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Main
Date: 08 Jul 2006 23:01:59
From: jahammel68
Subject: blackened the bottom of my pot!
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good day-
I've been doing 3 gallon boils and then topping that off with 2
gallons of (boiled) water to make a 5 gallon batch. Recently decided
to use my aluminum turkey fryer pot - 7+ gallon capacity.
Doing partial extract partial grain - had 5 gallons at about 150 F
after mash and added extract and boil hops and then turned on burners
to bring to / start boil. Figured I'd be OK with that technique, but
then after transfer to carboy I found a nice black dot across most of
the bottom of the boil pot. Is there anything I can do/use to get
this off? I assume some elbow grease and steelwool, but don't know
what the potential issue(s) would be with a scratched up bottom of the
pan.
PS - any input on correcting my technique would also be appreciated -
don't want to do this when I get my big SS boil pot. Thanks...jeff
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Date: 09 Jul 2006 10:46:05
From: Mark R
Subject: Re: blackened the bottom of my pot!
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"jahammel68" <jahammel68@rem0vethis.yahoo.com > wrote in message
news:s231b25cf3mdfq59fbj157p6u9a6b89a6t@4ax.com...
> good day-
>
> I've been doing 3 gallon boils and then topping that off with 2
> gallons of (boiled) water to make a 5 gallon batch. Recently decided
> to use my aluminum turkey fryer pot - 7+ gallon capacity.
>
> Doing partial extract partial grain - had 5 gallons at about 150 F
> after mash and added extract and boil hops and then turned on burners
> to bring to / start boil. Figured I'd be OK with that technique, but
> then after transfer to carboy I found a nice black dot across most of
> the bottom of the boil pot. Is there anything I can do/use to get
> this off? I assume some elbow grease and steelwool, but don't know
> what the potential issue(s) would be with a scratched up bottom of the
> pan.
>
> PS - any input on correcting my technique would also be appreciated -
> don't want to do this when I get my big SS boil pot. Thanks...jeff
It's probably your technique. Extract is very thick and will settle to the
bottom of the pot where even the smallest amount not thoroughly stirred in
will burn and leave spots on the bottom of your pot. This can happen even
before it comes to a full boil as the propane burner is really throwing the
heat to the pot. I do the same as you except that I stir the extract in for
a good ten minutes or more before I even apply the heat to the pot.
I burned extract to the bottom of my pot twice before I changed my
technique. My pots stainless and I just let a little PBW and water soak in
the bottom of the pot. Then I scrubbed with one of those plastic scrubbies.
It cleaned it right up. Not sure if PBW is good for aluminum.
Mark R
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Date: 09 Jul 2006 22:52:51
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: blackened the bottom of my pot!
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On Sun, 9 Jul 2006 10:46:05 -0500, <marknorayspam@noev1spam.net > wrote:
> It's probably your technique. Extract is very thick and will settle to the
> bottom of the pot where even the smallest amount not thoroughly stirred in
> will burn and leave spots on the bottom of your pot. This can happen even
> before it comes to a full boil as the propane burner is really throwing the
> heat to the pot. I do the same as you except that I stir the extract in for
> a good ten minutes or more before I even apply the heat to the pot.
I use an electric hand blender, it does a really good job of mixing in
the extract.
John.
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Date: 09 Jul 2006 00:09:22
From: Deacon Bluez
Subject: Re: blackened the bottom of my pot!
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Is the spot just turning dark brown or is it black due to stuck on residue?
I also use the 7 gallon pot and the inside has some brown scorch marks but
nothing major, it is actually expected with the aluminum. Since its
aluminum I wouldn't scrub the spots off if its just discolored. What I have
been told about aluminum is to let it change color and do not scratch the
pot with a scouring pad. If it is the oxidation from boiling its OK from
what I have read in all of the books and many past posts here. If you have
extract that is stuck to the bottom you want to get it off but don't want to
scratch the surface. I have had no off flavors from the oxidation or normal
use of the pot.
I am making the move to stainless steel kegs so I can retire the turkey
fryer. It has served me well but has really begun showing signs of use. I
just make sure that it is clean with nothing stuck to it and never use steel
wool or anything that is really abrasive. I have found the pads made for
teflon or the high end cookware work well.
Hope this helps.
Deacon
"jahammel68" <jahammel68@rem0vethis.yahoo.com > wrote in message
news:s231b25cf3mdfq59fbj157p6u9a6b89a6t@4ax.com...
> good day-
>
> I've been doing 3 gallon boils and then topping that off with 2
> gallons of (boiled) water to make a 5 gallon batch. Recently decided
> to use my aluminum turkey fryer pot - 7+ gallon capacity.
>
> Doing partial extract partial grain - had 5 gallons at about 150 F
> after mash and added extract and boil hops and then turned on burners
> to bring to / start boil. Figured I'd be OK with that technique, but
> then after transfer to carboy I found a nice black dot across most of
> the bottom of the boil pot. Is there anything I can do/use to get
> this off? I assume some elbow grease and steelwool, but don't know
> what the potential issue(s) would be with a scratched up bottom of the
> pan.
>
> PS - any input on correcting my technique would also be appreciated -
> don't want to do this when I get my big SS boil pot. Thanks...jeff
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Date: 08 Jul 2006 23:57:49
From: Washu
Subject: Re: blackened the bottom of my pot!
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jahammel68 wrote:
> then after transfer to carboy I found a nice black dot across most of
> the bottom of the boil pot. Is there anything I can do/use to get
> this off? I assume some elbow grease and steelwool, but don't know
> what the potential issue(s) would be with a scratched up bottom of the
> pan.
For now steelwool and elbow grease. In the future soap the bottom of
your pan, that's an old camping trick I learned more years ago than I
can to count. Shouldn't be any issues as long as you don't rub a hole
through the bottom of the pan. ;)
> PS - any input on correcting my technique would also be appreciated -
> don't want to do this when I get my big SS boil pot. Thanks...jeff
Just got my cooker this weekend and have yet to try it but from what I
have gathered you need to adjust the air/fuel mixture with the damper
to get a nice blue flame. Yellow is not your friend, too much oxygen
means an inefficient burn meaning that unburnt fuel has to go somewhere
and part of that somewhere is soot.
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Date: 09 Jul 2006 20:38:30
From: Washu
Subject: Re: blackened the bottom of my pot!
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John 'Shaggy' Kolesar wrote:
> I use an electric hand blender, it does a really good job of mixing in
> the extract.
John, would that be one of those plastic paddled mixer/aerator things
like I got from midwest supplies? If so do you have to worry about
hotside aeration or is that not an issue considering that the boil will
drive off the oxygen anyway?
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Date: 10 Jul 2006 14:01:27
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: blackened the bottom of my pot!
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On 9 Jul 2006 20:38:30 -0700, <rgrantha@yahoo.com > wrote:
>
> John 'Shaggy' Kolesar wrote:
>> I use an electric hand blender, it does a really good job of mixing in
>> the extract.
>
> John, would that be one of those plastic paddled mixer/aerator things
> like I got from midwest supplies? If so do you have to worry about
> hotside aeration or is that not an issue considering that the boil will
> drive off the oxygen anyway?
No, an electric hand blender is different than a Mix-stir aerator. Here's
the kind of thing I'm talking about:
http://www.chefdepot.net/braunmixer.htm
I don't think HSA would be anything to worry about as long as you keep
the blender below the surface of the wort while you are mixing. I'm usually
careful not to break the surface of it while the blender is on, otherwise
you'll get a lot of foaming and agitation of the surface. I've never
had any problems.
John.
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Date: 09 Jul 2006 21:50:46
From: Todd
Subject: Re: blackened the bottom of my pot!
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"jahammel68" <jahammel68@rem0vethis.yahoo.com > wrote in message
news:s231b25cf3mdfq59fbj157p6u9a6b89a6t@4ax.com...
> good day-
>
> I've been doing 3 gallon boils and then topping that off with 2
> gallons of (boiled) water to make a 5 gallon batch. Recently decided
> to use my aluminum turkey fryer pot - 7+ gallon capacity.
>
> Doing partial extract partial grain - had 5 gallons at about 150 F
> after mash and added extract and boil hops and then turned on burners
> to bring to / start boil. Figured I'd be OK with that technique, but
> then after transfer to carboy I found a nice black dot across most of
> the bottom of the boil pot. Is there anything I can do/use to get
> this off? I assume some elbow grease and steelwool, but don't know
> what the potential issue(s) would be with a scratched up bottom of the
> pan.
>
> PS - any input on correcting my technique would also be appreciated -
> don't want to do this when I get my big SS boil pot. Thanks...jeff
Some of the posters replying to your post have assumed the black dot is on
the inside of the pot, others have assumed it's on the outside. Re-reading
your post, I can't tell which it is. Which is it?
Todd
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Date: 09 Jul 2006 21:52:48
From: jahammel68
Subject: Re: blackened the bottom of my pot!
|
>"jahammel68" <jahammel68@rem0vethis.yahoo.com> wrote in message
>news:s231b25cf3mdfq59fbj157p6u9a6b89a6t@4ax.com...
>> good day-
>>
>> I've been doing 3 gallon boils and then topping that off with 2
>> gallons of (boiled) water to make a 5 gallon batch. Recently decided
>> to use my aluminum turkey fryer pot - 7+ gallon capacity.
>>
>> Doing partial extract partial grain - had 5 gallons at about 150 F
>> after mash and added extract and boil hops and then turned on burners
>> to bring to / start boil. Figured I'd be OK with that technique, but
>> then after transfer to carboy I found a nice black dot across most of
>> the bottom of the boil pot. Is there anything I can do/use to get
>> this off? I assume some elbow grease and steelwool, but don't know
>> what the potential issue(s) would be with a scratched up bottom of the
>> pan.
>>
>> PS - any input on correcting my technique would also be appreciated -
>> don't want to do this when I get my big SS boil pot. Thanks...jeff
>
>Some of the posters replying to your post have assumed the black dot is on
>the inside of the pot, others have assumed it's on the outside. Re-reading
>your post, I can't tell which it is. Which is it?
>
>Todd
>
Yeah - I saw that after reading the responses - my bad. The blackened
side of the pot is on the INside on the bottom. I figured it was my
technique as pointed out earlier in reponses to my original - the
heavy extract sunk to the bottom of the pot and cooked on to the
bottom / caused a black layer. Again - this is on the INside of the
pot.
Next time, I'll make sure I stir the heck out of the extract so I
don't have to avoid this. I've heard that black (scorch) on the
inside of the pot can affect taste and also darken the final color,
but I've been happy with my batches thus far.
Thanks to all the responders and so sorry for the confusion.
Hopefully I'll be getting a mash / lauter tun in the near future and
can get away from the extract. Thanks again...jeff
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Date: 09 Jul 2006 09:32:02
From: Scott L
Subject: Re: blackened the bottom of my pot!
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jahammel68 wrote:
> I found a nice black dot across most of
> the bottom of the boil pot. Is there anything I can do/use to get
> this off? I assume some elbow grease and steelwool, but don't know
> what the potential issue(s) would be with a scratched up bottom of the
> pan.
There's a very important point to be made here. It's "okay" to clean
aluminum with steel wool, but NEVER clean stainless steel with it!
Still, I wouldn't recommend steel wool. Get the most abrasive cleaning
pad you can find (the red/brown ones seem to be more abrasive than the
green ones) and scrub using that. Steel wool will not only scratch your
pot but over time will actually remove a significant amount of metal
from it.
The exposed aluminum will look bright and shiny. This may motivate you
to clean the rest of the pot to make it all bright and shiny. Resist
that motivation. Your only goal is to remove the black stain. In the
past I have recommended oven cleaner for this purpose. Do NOT use oven
cleaner on aluminum, it will eat it away.
If you have access to a pressure washer, I'd give that a try as well.
Scott
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Date: 10 Jul 2006 10:33:09
From: Gerard Eberlein
Subject: Re: blackened the bottom of my pot!
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"jahammel68" <jahammel68@rem0vethis.yahoo.com > wrote in message
news:s231b25cf3mdfq59fbj157p6u9a6b89a6t@4ax.com...
> PS - any input on correcting my technique would also be appreciated -
> don't want to do this when I get my big SS boil pot. Thanks...jeff
Personally I have my girlfriend pour it in while i stir with a slotted
paddle and the heat it off. She adds it slowly so as long as I keep stirring
and scraping the bottom of the pot it never gets a chance to stick. I don't
wait to turn the heat back on, but I also never stop stirring and scraping
the bottom until it gets back to a rapid boil. Haven't scorched one yet.
good luck.
Gerard
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Date: 10 Jul 2006 05:47:48
From: brian@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: blackened the bottom of my pot!
|
jahammel68 wrote:
> >"jahammel68" <jahammel68@rem0vethis.yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >news:s231b25cf3mdfq59fbj157p6u9a6b89a6t@4ax.com...
> >> good day-
> >>
> >> I've been doing 3 gallon boils and then topping that off with 2
> >> gallons of (boiled) water to make a 5 gallon batch. Recently decided
> >> to use my aluminum turkey fryer pot - 7+ gallon capacity.
> >>
> >> Doing partial extract partial grain - had 5 gallons at about 150 F
> >> after mash and added extract and boil hops and then turned on burners
> >> to bring to / start boil. Figured I'd be OK with that technique, but
> >> then after transfer to carboy I found a nice black dot across most of
> >> the bottom of the boil pot. Is there anything I can do/use to get
> >> this off? I assume some elbow grease and steelwool, but don't know
> >> what the potential issue(s) would be with a scratched up bottom of the
> >> pan.
> >>
> >> PS - any input on correcting my technique would also be appreciated -
> >> don't want to do this when I get my big SS boil pot. Thanks...jeff
> >
> >Some of the posters replying to your post have assumed the black dot is on
> >the inside of the pot, others have assumed it's on the outside. Re-reading
> >your post, I can't tell which it is. Which is it?
> >
> >Todd
> >
> Yeah - I saw that after reading the responses - my bad. The blackened
> side of the pot is on the INside on the bottom. I figured it was my
> technique as pointed out earlier in reponses to my original - the
> heavy extract sunk to the bottom of the pot and cooked on to the
> bottom / caused a black layer. Again - this is on the INside of the
> pot.
>
> Next time, I'll make sure I stir the heck out of the extract so I
> don't have to avoid this. I've heard that black (scorch) on the
> inside of the pot can affect taste and also darken the final color,
> but I've been happy with my batches thus far.
>
> Thanks to all the responders and so sorry for the confusion.
> Hopefully I'll be getting a mash / lauter tun in the near future and
> can get away from the extract. Thanks again...jeff
One technique suggestion is to get to near boiling before adding the
extract. That way you will need to hit it with high heat for a shorter
time before boiling begins and also the very hot water will dissolve
the extract better. Also, I have been told not to add bittering hops
untill after the initial hot break (foam at boiling) subsides. Adding
earlier will have more of a first wort hopping effect rendering more
flavor than bitterness from the hops.
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Date: 10 Jul 2006 14:04:41
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: blackened the bottom of my pot!
|
On 10 Jul 2006 05:47:48 -0700, <brian.sico@gmail.com > wrote:
> One technique suggestion is to get to near boiling before adding the
> extract. That way you will need to hit it with high heat for a shorter
> time before boiling begins and also the very hot water will dissolve
> the extract better. Also, I have been told not to add bittering hops
> untill after the initial hot break (foam at boiling) subsides. Adding
> earlier will have more of a first wort hopping effect rendering more
> flavor than bitterness from the hops.
What I do is to bring plain water to a boil, then turn off the heat and
stir in the extract using an electric hand blender, making sure to get it
as thoroughly disolved as I can. Then, once I'm sure that I've stirred
enough, I turn the heat back on and continue with the boil. IMO, turning
off the heat while you add the extract is important.
John.
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Date: 10 Jul 2006 08:33:10
From: Mark R
Subject: Re: blackened the bottom of my pot!
|
"brian@yahoo.com" <brian.sico@gmail.com > wrote in message
>
> One technique suggestion is to get to near boiling before adding the
> extract. That way you will need to hit it with high heat for a shorter
> time before boiling begins and also the very hot water will dissolve
> the extract better. Also, I have been told not to add bittering hops
> untill after the initial hot break
That's a good technique that I use when doing my pale ale and kolsch
recipes. When I'm doing my browns, ESB, porter, etc, I don't worry about the
SRM as much. I always wait until after the boil starts to throw in my hops.
Never really gotten much hot break doing partial extract recipes with small
amounts of grain.
Mark R
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Date: 10 Jul 2006 11:37:34
From: Scott L
Subject: Re: blackened the bottom of my pot!
|
Scott Alfter wrote:
> If you're getting soot from a gas burner, the mixture is too rich. If
> you're using a turkey fryer (or something similar), the round disc with two
> triangular holes in it is your mixture adjustment. If you turn it so that
> it lets more air in, that'll lean out the mix and your pots won't get dirty.
> You'll also use less fuel to get the same work done.
Does anybody know why these burners even have these adjustments? It
seems like it only works with the air wide open -- nice blue, hot, even
flame. Any lower setting just makes the flame yellow, sooty, and weak.
What's the point? When would you ever change the adjustment?
Scott
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Date: 10 Jul 2006 22:20:14
From: Scott Alfter
Subject: Re: blackened the bottom of my pot!
|
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1
In article <1152556654.546381.133100@s13g2000cwa.googlegroups.com >,
Scott L <scott-sp02@neuralnw.com > wrote:
>Scott Alfter wrote:
>> If you're getting soot from a gas burner, the mixture is too rich. If
>> you're using a turkey fryer (or something similar), the round disc with two
>> triangular holes in it is your mixture adjustment. If you turn it so that
>> it lets more air in, that'll lean out the mix and your pots won't get dirty.
>> You'll also use less fuel to get the same work done.
>
>Does anybody know why these burners even have these adjustments? It
>seems like it only works with the air wide open -- nice blue, hot, even
>flame. Any lower setting just makes the flame yellow, sooty, and weak.
>What's the point? When would you ever change the adjustment?
With mine all the way open, they tend to blow themselves out. I usually run
them half-open (or thereabouts). If I had to guess, there's a fair chance
that differences in elevation, humidity, etc. can call for tweaking the mix
so that it burns blue without blowing itself out.
_/_
/ v \ Scott Alfter (remove the obvious to send mail)
(IIGS( http://alfter.us/ Top-posting!
\_^_/ rm -rf /bin/laden >What's the most annoying thing on Usenet?
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Date: 11 Jul 2006 15:29:22
From: Todd
Subject: Re: blackened the bottom of my pot!
|
It would be interesting if Scott L and Scott Alter would report their
elevations.
Todd
"Scott Alfter" <scott@alfter.diespammersdie.us > wrote in message
news:44b2d29e$0$18481$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com...
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> In article <1152556654.546381.133100@s13g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
> Scott L <scott-sp02@neuralnw.com> wrote:
> >Scott Alfter wrote:
> >> If you're getting soot from a gas burner, the mixture is too rich. If
> >> you're using a turkey fryer (or something similar), the round disc with
two
> >> triangular holes in it is your mixture adjustment. If you turn it so
that
> >> it lets more air in, that'll lean out the mix and your pots won't get
dirty.
> >> You'll also use less fuel to get the same work done.
> >
> >Does anybody know why these burners even have these adjustments? It
> >seems like it only works with the air wide open -- nice blue, hot, even
> >flame. Any lower setting just makes the flame yellow, sooty, and weak.
> >What's the point? When would you ever change the adjustment?
>
> With mine all the way open, they tend to blow themselves out. I usually
run
> them half-open (or thereabouts). If I had to guess, there's a fair chance
> that differences in elevation, humidity, etc. can call for tweaking the
mix
> so that it burns blue without blowing itself out.
>
> _/_
> / v \ Scott Alfter (remove the obvious to send mail)
> (IIGS( http://alfter.us/ Top-posting!
> \_^_/ rm -rf /bin/laden >What's the most annoying thing on
Usenet?
>
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.4.2.2 (GNU/Linux)
>
> iD8DBQFEstM6VgTKos01OwkRAqQ1AJ9SnZNWWkzxqqjFnFVwLyvurbBgDACfZPd0
> Nrk8cmZmyEdAes80MQuxiJQ=
> =ugm9
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
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Date: 12 Jul 2006 17:19:15
From: Scott Alfter
Subject: Re: blackened the bottom of my pot!
|
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1
In article <mtPsg.19023$LS6.5739@trnddc03 >, Todd <Noname@NoSpam.invalid> wrote:
>It would be interesting if Scott L and Scott Alter [sic] would report their
>elevations.
Las Vegas is at about 2000'.
_/_
/ v \ Scott Alfter (remove the obvious to send mail)
(IIGS( http://alfter.us/ Top-posting!
\_^_/ rm -rf /bin/laden >What's the most annoying thing on Usenet?
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=BO6Z
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Date: 10 Jul 2006 18:54:06
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: blackened the bottom of my pot!
|
On 10 Jul 2006 11:37:34 -0700, <scott-sp02@neuralnw.com > wrote:
> Scott Alfter wrote:
>> If you're getting soot from a gas burner, the mixture is too rich. If
>> you're using a turkey fryer (or something similar), the round disc with two
>> triangular holes in it is your mixture adjustment. If you turn it so that
>> it lets more air in, that'll lean out the mix and your pots won't get dirty.
>> You'll also use less fuel to get the same work done.
>
> Does anybody know why these burners even have these adjustments? It
> seems like it only works with the air wide open -- nice blue, hot, even
> flame. Any lower setting just makes the flame yellow, sooty, and weak.
> What's the point? When would you ever change the adjustment?
The adjustment is on the burner though, not the regulator. I'm not sure, but
I guess it would make a difference whether you have a high or low pressure
regulator. Also, your location may effect it as well. Elevation above sea
level will effect the density of the air. I don't know if any of that has
enough of an effect to change the characteristic of the flame?
Maybe there are applications for these burners where you want a yellow flame?
John.
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Date: 10 Jul 2006 17:36:08
From: Scott Alfter
Subject: Re: blackened the bottom of my pot!
|
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1
In article <s231b25cf3mdfq59fbj157p6u9a6b89a6t@4ax.com >,
jahammel68 <jahammel68@rem0vethis.yahoo.com > wrote:
>PS - any input on correcting my technique would also be appreciated -
>don't want to do this when I get my big SS boil pot. Thanks...jeff
If you're getting soot from a gas burner, the mixture is too rich. If
you're using a turkey fryer (or something similar), the round disc with two
triangular holes in it is your mixture adjustment. If you turn it so that
it lets more air in, that'll lean out the mix and your pots won't get dirty.
You'll also use less fuel to get the same work done.
I don't know how you would adjust other types of burners. If it turns out
your burner isn't adjustable, do what Boy Scouts do: wipe some dishwashing
detergent on the outside of the pot. The soot will wash off more easily.
_/_
/ v \ Scott Alfter (remove the obvious to send mail)
(IIGS( http://alfter.us/ Top-posting!
\_^_/ rm -rf /bin/laden >What's the most annoying thing on Usenet?
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
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=zee8
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Date: 11 Jul 2006 08:59:20
From: Scott L
Subject: Re: blackened the bottom of my pot!
|
Todd wrote:
> It would be interesting if Scott L and Scott Alter would report their
> elevations.
I'm essentially at sea level.
Scott
|
|
