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Date: 24 Jul 2006 23:20:51
From: Steve/Aus
Subject: Warm Lagering?
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I have a couple of lagers conditioning at close to freezing. They are quite
good beers but still need a bit of cleaning up - just aging and mellowing a
little as they are quite malty and pretty damn hoppy. They are in corny kegs
and at the correct level of carbonation.
I am thinking that they might clean up a bit quicker if I leave them out at
ambient temperatures for a while. The current maximum daytime high in my
shed is about 16°C as it's winter here so, we're not talking hot-hot.
The therory is that any residual yeast is likely to be more active at a
higher temperature. However, I have always believed that slow yeast activity
is not the only factor that conditions beer. There wouldn't be much yeast in
the kegs in any case as they were forced carbonated.
FYI, they were lagered in the secondary for four weeks with a reasonable of
yeast present.
Steve W (in Aus)
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Date: 24 Jul 2006 23:50:52
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: Warm Lagering?
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On Mon, 24 Jul 2006 23:20:51 GMT, <adlab@bigponddotnetdotau.trashthisbit > wrote:
> I have a couple of lagers conditioning at close to freezing. They are quite
> good beers but still need a bit of cleaning up - just aging and mellowing a
> little as they are quite malty and pretty damn hoppy. They are in corny kegs
> and at the correct level of carbonation.
> I am thinking that they might clean up a bit quicker if I leave them out at
> ambient temperatures for a while. The current maximum daytime high in my
> shed is about 16°C as it's winter here so, we're not talking hot-hot.
> The therory is that any residual yeast is likely to be more active at a
> higher temperature. However, I have always believed that slow yeast activity
> is not the only factor that conditions beer. There wouldn't be much yeast in
> the kegs in any case as they were forced carbonated.
> FYI, they were lagered in the secondary for four weeks with a reasonable of
> yeast present.
Warm lagering would certainly be a lot easier than holding the beer at
near freezing temps. IMO, if that's all there were to it then it's hard to
imagine why everyone who lagers goes to the expense/trouble to do it cold.
I think you'll find effects due to being warm other than just faster yeast
activity. Other off flavors from the yeast, etc. IOW, even though the
activity is slower, there are probably reasons you want them to clean up cold.
It sounds like a good experiment, but faster isn't always better.
John.
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Date: 24 Jul 2006 23:57:01
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: Warm Lagering?
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On 24 Jul 2006 23:50:52 GMT, <spam@shagg.net > wrote:
> On Mon, 24 Jul 2006 23:20:51 GMT, <adlab@bigponddotnetdotau.trashthisbit> wrote:
>> I have a couple of lagers conditioning at close to freezing. They are quite
>> good beers but still need a bit of cleaning up - just aging and mellowing a
>> little as they are quite malty and pretty damn hoppy. They are in corny kegs
>> and at the correct level of carbonation.
>> I am thinking that they might clean up a bit quicker if I leave them out at
>> ambient temperatures for a while. The current maximum daytime high in my
>> shed is about 16°C as it's winter here so, we're not talking hot-hot.
>> The therory is that any residual yeast is likely to be more active at a
>> higher temperature. However, I have always believed that slow yeast activity
>> is not the only factor that conditions beer. There wouldn't be much yeast in
>> the kegs in any case as they were forced carbonated.
>> FYI, they were lagered in the secondary for four weeks with a reasonable of
>> yeast present.
>
> Warm lagering would certainly be a lot easier than holding the beer at
> near freezing temps. IMO, if that's all there were to it then it's hard to
> imagine why everyone who lagers goes to the expense/trouble to do it cold.
> I think you'll find effects due to being warm other than just faster yeast
> activity. Other off flavors from the yeast, etc. IOW, even though the
> activity is slower, there are probably reasons you want them to clean up cold.
>
> It sounds like a good experiment, but faster isn't always better.
I missed where you said that they were lagered for four weeks already. That
would probably make any impact from warming them up now less. If it were
my beer, and they were already lagered for four weeks, then I probably
wouldn't worry about it too much. When you said "clean up" I was mostly
thinking about the lager yeast cleaning up by products left over from
fermentation, which is what the cold lagering is mostly about. The yeast
are involved in aging as well, which is what you're talking about now, but
I don't know how much impact the temp has beyond the time factor. It's
an interesting question.
Try it and see how they come out. If you like it, that'll certainly save
some time/effort in the future.
John.
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Date: 25 Jul 2006 06:11:47
From: Dick Adams
Subject: Re: Warm Lagering?
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Steve/Aus <adlab@bigponddotnetdotau.trashthisbit > wrote:
> I have a couple of lagers conditioning at close to freezing. They are quite
> good beers but still need a bit of cleaning up - just aging and mellowing a
> little as they are quite malty and pretty damn hoppy. They are in corny kegs
> and at the correct level of carbonation.
>
> I am thinking that they might clean up a bit quicker if I leave them out at
> ambient temperatures for a while. The current maximum daytime high in my
> shed is about 16°C as it's winter here so, we're not talking hot-hot.
16C is 60.8F. That's not winter to those of us who live in the
land of the damnyankee snow.
> The theory is that any residual yeast is likely to be more active at a
> higher temperature. However, I have always believed that slow yeast activity
> is not the only factor that conditions beer. There wouldn't be much yeast in
> the kegs in any case as they were forced carbonated.
IMO 16C is cool and should not be a problem. However, I'm not
certain that 16C is warm enough to promote yeast activity. I
ferment and secondary Meads at that temperature and then leave
the secondary out at 20-22C for a few days before racking into
a carboy.
Also I do notunderstand "There wouldn't be much yeast in the kegs
in any case as they were forced carbonated." Why forced
carbonation eliminate any yeast?
Dick
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Date: 25 Jul 2006 07:15:43
From: Steve/Aus
Subject: Re: Warm Lagering?
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"Dick Adams" <rdadams@smart.net > wrote in message
news:12cbdh3fetdi20e@corp.supernews.com...
> Steve/Aus <adlab@bigponddotnetdotau.trashthisbit> wrote:
> IMO 16C is cool and should not be a problem. However, I'm not
> certain that 16C is warm enough to promote yeast activity. I
> ferment and secondary Meads at that temperature and then leave
> the secondary out at 20-22C for a few days before racking into
> a carboy.
Lager yeasts ferment at low temperatures, 16C is considered bikini weather
for lager yeast!
> Also I do notunderstand "There wouldn't be much yeast in the kegs
> in any case as they were forced carbonated." Why forced
> carbonation eliminate any yeast?
After 2 weeks primary I rack to a secondary leaving most of the yeast behind
as most it has precipitated out by then. Then four weeks in the secondary at
cold temperatures with the addition of gelatine in the last week
precipitates any remaining suspended yeast out. Of course, there would be
some left but it would be fairly minimal and the beer is very bright when
racked to the keg.
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