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Date: 06 Nov 2006 14:36:08
From: Mike
Subject: Steeping time?
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Most recipes I've seen says to steep for 30 minutes. Is it possible
to steep for to long? Does steeping for a longer time give different
flavor?
-m
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Date: 06 Nov 2006 15:47:57
From: alebrewer
Subject: Re: Steeping time?
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Mike wrote:
> Most recipes I've seen says to steep for 30 minutes. Is it possible
> to steep for to long? Does steeping for a longer time give different
> flavor?
>
> -m
Longer (and shorter) times will produce different flavors, which is
just another way of saying that steeping time affects flavor. How much
it affects the flavor, and if it is a positive or negative effect
(how's that for using affect and effect in the same sentance?) depends
on way too many variables to go into. The 30 minute number is given
because by that time, most of the sugars and color has come out but the
tannins and other harsh tasting chemicals have not gotten out of hand.
I've always tried to use 20-30 minutes.
Longer times are definately used when mashing (an hour, maybe 2), but
in a mash, you have a much better control on the pH and other
variables.
But, experiment and find what you like best. That is what really
matters.
ab
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Date: 06 Nov 2006 15:24:24
From: Ronin
Subject: Re: Steeping time?
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I know squeezing the grain bag to get the runoff is bad because of the
tannins in the grain, but I don't know if an extended soak can do the
same or not.
Mike wrote:
> Most recipes I've seen says to steep for 30 minutes. Is it possible
> to steep for to long? Does steeping for a longer time give different
> flavor?
>
> -m
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Date: 07 Nov 2006 16:05:39
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: Steeping time?
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On 6 Nov 2006 14:36:08 -0800, <michaelschmit@yahoo.com > wrote:
> Most recipes I've seen says to steep for 30 minutes. Is it possible
> to steep for to long? Does steeping for a longer time give different
> flavor?
I don't think steeping for longer hurts anything, but it probably doesn't
help either. IOW, you can let it go for as long as you want, but after
around 30 minutes it's essentially done.
There is such a thing as "cold steeping" that occurs over a *much* longer
duration, but that's really a different type of thing all together. It's
not used much except for very special cases.
John.
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Date: 07 Nov 2006 16:26:53
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: Steeping time?
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On 7 Nov 2006 16:05:39 GMT, <spam@shagg.net > wrote:
> On 6 Nov 2006 14:36:08 -0800, <michaelschmit@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Most recipes I've seen says to steep for 30 minutes. Is it possible
>> to steep for to long? Does steeping for a longer time give different
>> flavor?
>
> I don't think steeping for longer hurts anything, but it probably doesn't
> help either. IOW, you can let it go for as long as you want, but after
> around 30 minutes it's essentially done.
Just to be specific, I assume we're not talking about *really* long steeping
times. IOW, 30 minutes, 45 minutes, or 60 minutes probably doesn't make
any real difference. It's possible to run into problems if you let them
steep for a really long time according to Palmer, but he's talking about
several hours of steeping. My statement above was making an assumption that
you were not talking about it on that scale.
John.
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Date: 07 Nov 2006 12:01:35
From: Dan Logcher
Subject: Re: Steeping time?
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John 'Shaggy' Kolesar wrote:
> On 7 Nov 2006 16:05:39 GMT, <spam@shagg.net> wrote:
>
>>On 6 Nov 2006 14:36:08 -0800, <michaelschmit@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>>Most recipes I've seen says to steep for 30 minutes. Is it possible
>>>to steep for to long? Does steeping for a longer time give different
>>>flavor?
>>
>>I don't think steeping for longer hurts anything, but it probably doesn't
>>help either. IOW, you can let it go for as long as you want, but after
>>around 30 minutes it's essentially done.
>
>
> Just to be specific, I assume we're not talking about *really* long steeping
> times. IOW, 30 minutes, 45 minutes, or 60 minutes probably doesn't make
> any real difference. It's possible to run into problems if you let them
> steep for a really long time according to Palmer, but he's talking about
> several hours of steeping. My statement above was making an assumption that
> you were not talking about it on that scale.
I've been going 45 minutes for my steeps. I guess I could shave 15 minutes
off by stopping at 30.
--
Dan
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Date: 07 Nov 2006 20:19:50
From: Ronin
Subject: Re: Steeping time?
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That's what is so cool about homebrew. You get to PLAY!!!! You can
find out what suits your tastes best!
Play with it, and have fun.
John Krehbiel wrote:
> Mike wrote:
> > Most recipes I've seen says to steep for 30 minutes. Is it possible
> > to steep for to long? Does steeping for a longer time give different
> > flavor?
> >
> > -m
> Quite a while back some kind soul sent me a file (which of course I
> have lost) on just this subject.
>
> It described an experiment where they compared boiling grains, normal
> short-term steeping in hot water, and overnight steeping in cold water.
> They claimed that the best results came from the overnight steep in
> cold water- less astringency, better flavor, etc.
>
> Not being one to take anybody at their word and just follow directions,
> I tried a hybrid method: I boiled clear water and added the dark grains
> to the water after it was taken off the heat. I allowed that to steep
> overnight.
>
> I couldn't really tell any difference between that and my normal
> steeping technique, which for extract beers was to put the grains in
> the cold water as I heated it, and strain them out when the water was
> close to boiling.
>
> As with everything else, your results may vary, play around with it.
>
> John
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Date: 07 Nov 2006 16:02:04
From: John Krehbiel
Subject: Re: Steeping time?
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Mike wrote:
> Most recipes I've seen says to steep for 30 minutes. Is it possible
> to steep for to long? Does steeping for a longer time give different
> flavor?
>
> -m
Quite a while back some kind soul sent me a file (which of course I
have lost) on just this subject.
It described an experiment where they compared boiling grains, normal
short-term steeping in hot water, and overnight steeping in cold water.
They claimed that the best results came from the overnight steep in
cold water- less astringency, better flavor, etc.
Not being one to take anybody at their word and just follow directions,
I tried a hybrid method: I boiled clear water and added the dark grains
to the water after it was taken off the heat. I allowed that to steep
overnight.
I couldn't really tell any difference between that and my normal
steeping technique, which for extract beers was to put the grains in
the cold water as I heated it, and strain them out when the water was
close to boiling.
As with everything else, your results may vary, play around with it.
John
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Date: 23 Nov 2006 00:18:50
From: Scott Sellers
Subject: Re: Steeping time?
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John Krehbiel <jkrehbielp@gmail.com >:
>Mike wrote:
>> Most recipes I've seen says to steep for 30 minutes. Is it
>> possible to steep for to long? Does steeping for a longer
>> time give different flavor?
>>
>> -m
>Quite a while back some kind soul sent me a file (which of
>course I have lost) on just this subject.
>It described an experiment where they compared boiling grains,
>normal short-term steeping in hot water, and overnight steeping
>in cold water. They claimed that the best results came from the
>overnight steep in cold water- less astringency, better flavor,
>etc.
>Not being one to take anybody at their word and just follow
>directions, I tried a hybrid method: I boiled clear water and
>added the dark grains to the water after it was taken off the
>heat. I allowed that to steep overnight.
>I couldn't really tell any difference between that and my normal
>steeping technique, which for extract beers was to put the
>grains in the cold water as I heated it, and strain them out
>when the water was close to boiling.
Either way, once the grains hit boiling, or near boiling, I don't
think it takes long to extract tannins. Then, the cat's out of
the bag. Soaking overnight (or not) wouldn't make much
difference.
>As with everything else, your results may vary, play around with
>it.
The cold steep method sounds similar to the "toddy" method of
cold brewing coffee -- never tried it, just heard it makes a very
smooth drink. Sounds interesting for beer.
If I was a steeper, and not a masher, I'd probably try it.
Scott S
--
Scott Sellers
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Date: 27 Nov 2006 09:19:56
From: Denny Conn
Subject: Re: Steeping time?
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Scott Sellers wrote:
> >I couldn't really tell any difference between that and my normal
> >steeping technique, which for extract beers was to put the
> >grains in the cold water as I heated it, and strain them out
> >when the water was close to boiling.
>
> Either way, once the grains hit boiling, or near boiling, I don't
> think it takes long to extract tannins. Then, the cat's out of
> the bag. Soaking overnight (or not) wouldn't make much
> difference.
Keep in mind that there's more tha simply temp involvrd in the
possibilty of tannin extraction. the grain must also be crushed finely
enough to make the tannins available, and most inportantly, the pH needs
to be high. pH control is the big reason "steepers" are advised to
control the amopunt of water they use.
----------- >Denny
--
Life begins at 60...1.060, that is.
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Date: 28 Nov 2006 22:04:01
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: Steeping time?
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On Mon, 27 Nov 2006 09:19:56 -0800, <denny.g.conn@ci.eugene.or.us > wrote:
> Keep in mind that there's more tha simply temp involvrd in the
> possibilty of tannin extraction. the grain must also be crushed finely
> enough to make the tannins available, and most inportantly, the pH needs
> to be high. pH control is the big reason "steepers" are advised to
> control the amopunt of water they use.
I could be wrong, but I believe that the temp and pH requirements are
related. IE, what could be a "safe" pH at 150F may be a "bad" pH at 200F
when it comes to tannin extraction. Basically, I think the definition of
"high" with regards to the pH will change depending on the temp. At least,
that's the impression I've gotten from various things I've read over
the years.
I think the rules of thumb for keeping the temp below a certain threshhold
(165F, 170F, etc depending on what text you're looking at) come from the
tyipcal pH range being safe below those temps, but have the potential for
problems above them.
John.
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