Liquid Yeast Storage

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Date: 21 Aug 2006 11:05:34
From: Joseph Love
Subject: Liquid Yeast Storage

Hello All,

Would there be negative effects to the liquid yeast cultures if allowed
to get to room temperature the placed back into a refrigerator?

I started a batch, but aborted due to a rookie mistake, and then placed
the liquid yeast back in the cooler after sitting out for 3 or 4 hours.
I know temperatures above 100F is bad, but should I expect any negative
outcomes by re-chilling it?

TIA,
Joe

Date: 21 Aug 2006 18:23:41
From: John Bleichert
Subject: Re: Liquid Yeast Storage

Joseph Love <joe@gmail.com > wrote:
> Hello All,
>
> Would there be negative effects to the liquid yeast cultures if allowed
> to get to room temperature the placed back into a refrigerator?
>
> I started a batch, but aborted due to a rookie mistake, and then placed
> the liquid yeast back in the cooler after sitting out for 3 or 4 hours.
> I know temperatures above 100F is bad, but should I expect any negative
> outcomes by re-chilling it?
>
> TIA,
> Joe

I've had a couple vials arrive at my house via UPS during a heat wave
*hot*. I put them in the fridge and they've worked fine. Note that I
always make a stater when using liquid yeast. A starter is a good
test for yeast viability.

-----------------------------------------------
John Bleichert syborg@earthlink.net
The heat from below can burn your eyes out!!

Date: 21 Aug 2006 14:46:50
From: Joseph Love
Subject: Re: Liquid Yeast Storage

John Bleichert <syborg@earthlink.net > says...
>
> I've had a couple vials arrive at my house via UPS during a heat wave
> *hot*. I put them in the fridge and they've worked fine. Note that I
> always make a stater when using liquid yeast. A starter is a good
> test for yeast viability.

Thanks for all the helpful advice everyone.

This is my second batch, and first to use liquid yeast. I'm using White
Labs (WPL0002) and they don't mention using a starter. In general is
making a starter better than not? Less likehood of shock?

Thanks again,
Joe

Date: 21 Aug 2006 17:20:31
From: David M. Taylor
Subject: Re: Liquid Yeast Storage

"Joseph Love" <joe@gmail.com > wrote in message
news:MPG.1f53c9964bd951da989681@news.supernews.com...
>
> This is my second batch, and first to use liquid yeast. I'm using White
> Labs (WPL0002) and they don't mention using a starter. In general is
> making a starter better than not? Less likehood of shock?

Yes, with liquid yeasts, it's best to always make a starter. There's not
enough yeast cells in a vial of liquid yeast to minimize the lag between
pitching and fermentation. Don't get me wrong, it'll usually work if you
just pitch the vial, BUT, if the yeast cells are unhealthy and/or it lags
too long before fermentation, then you're at risk for off-flavors and
perhaps even contamination in the finished beer. "Too long" would be about
36 hours. Any longer than that, and you could be in for a surprise at the
end.

Dry yeast, don't bother with a starter. The huge advantages of dry yeast
are the cell count, and the cheap cost. But you don't get the variety of
yeast strains as you do with liquid yeast.

And if you ever make a lager, you need at least 10 gallons of yeast for a
5-gallon batch. (I'm kidding.) But you do need a lot... some say a gallon,
some more, some less.

--
Dave
"Just a drink, a little drink, and I'll be feeling GOOooOOooOOooD!" --
Genesis, 1973-ish

Date: 21 Aug 2006 15:36:24
From: Wheat
Subject: Re: Liquid Yeast Storage

"David M. Taylor" <dmtaylor@SPAM.geocities.SUCKS.com > wrote in message
news:NkqGg.448$Il1.135@newsfe06.lga...
> Dry yeast, don't bother with a starter. The huge advantages of dry yeast
> are the cell count, and the cheap cost. But you don't get the variety of
> yeast strains as you do with liquid yeast.

Is there an advantage, besides variety, of using liquid vs dry yeast?

Bill

Date: 21 Aug 2006 17:40:01
From: David M. Taylor
Subject: Re: Liquid Yeast Storage

"Wheat" <kotosho@netscape.net > wrote in message
news:QJKdndOAzP__qHfZnZ2dnUVZ_oOdnZ2d@comcast.com...
>
> Is there an advantage, besides variety, of using liquid vs dry yeast?

Heck no, at least not that I can think of. Dry yeast kicks butt. If there
was as much variety with dry yeast as with liquid, I wouldn't buy anything
but dry, and I think most everyone would agree.

--
Dave
"Just a drink, a little drink, and I'll be feeling GOOooOOooOOooD!" --
Genesis, 1973-ish

Date: 22 Aug 2006 17:56:42
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: Liquid Yeast Storage

On Mon, 21 Aug 2006 15:36:24 -0700, <kotosho@netscape.net > wrote:
>
>
> "David M. Taylor" <dmtaylor@SPAM.geocities.SUCKS.com> wrote in message
> news:NkqGg.448$Il1.135@newsfe06.lga...
>> Dry yeast, don't bother with a starter. The huge advantages of dry yeast
>> are the cell count, and the cheap cost. But you don't get the variety of
>> yeast strains as you do with liquid yeast.
>
> Is there an advantage, besides variety, of using liquid vs dry yeast?

No, just the variety of strains available.

John.

Date: 24 Aug 2006 17:32:50
From: Todd
Subject: Re: Liquid Yeast Storage

"Wheat" <kotosho@netscape.net > wrote in message
news:QJKdndOAzP__qHfZnZ2dnUVZ_oOdnZ2d@comcast.com...
>
>
> "David M. Taylor" <dmtaylor@SPAM.geocities.SUCKS.com> wrote in message
> news:NkqGg.448$Il1.135@newsfe06.lga...
> > Dry yeast, don't bother with a starter. The huge advantages of dry
yeast
> > are the cell count, and the cheap cost. But you don't get the variety
of
> > yeast strains as you do with liquid yeast.
>
> Is there an advantage, besides variety, of using liquid vs dry yeast?
>
> Bill
>

There used to be a big difference in quality, because the method for making
dry yeast allowed contamination of the yeast, and too often the yeast was
dead. Now if you can get the strain you want in dry yeast, the quality is
just as good, it cost less, it's easier to store, easier to use, and there
are more yeast cells per package.

Date: 22 Aug 2006 12:22:51
From: John Bleichert
Subject: Re: Liquid Yeast Storage

Joseph Love <joe@gmail.com > wrote:
> John Bleichert <syborg@earthlink.net> says...
>>
>> I've had a couple vials arrive at my house via UPS during a heat wave
>> *hot*. I put them in the fridge and they've worked fine. Note that I
>> always make a stater when using liquid yeast. A starter is a good
>> test for yeast viability.
>
> Thanks for all the helpful advice everyone.
>
> This is my second batch, and first to use liquid yeast. I'm using White
> Labs (WPL0002) and they don't mention using a starter. In general is
> making a starter better than not? Less likehood of shock?
>
> Thanks again,
> Joe

As others have stated, a starter is always a good idea with liquid
yeast. Palmer's page has a great intro. Among the other reasons
provided so far, a starter will allow your yeast to fully ferment a
high gravity beer. I made 2 IPA batches back-to-back at 1.060 - one
with a starter and one without. The batch with the starter finished at
1.010, the one without a starter finished at 1.018...

-----------------------------------------------
John Bleichert syborg@earthlink.net
The heat from below can burn your eyes out!!

Date: 22 Aug 2006 17:55:09
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: Liquid Yeast Storage

On Mon, 21 Aug 2006 14:46:50 -0700, <joe@gmail.com > wrote:
> John Bleichert <syborg@earthlink.net> says...
>>
>> I've had a couple vials arrive at my house via UPS during a heat wave
>> *hot*. I put them in the fridge and they've worked fine. Note that I
>> always make a stater when using liquid yeast. A starter is a good
>> test for yeast viability.
>
> Thanks for all the helpful advice everyone.
>
> This is my second batch, and first to use liquid yeast. I'm using White
> Labs (WPL0002) and they don't mention using a starter. In general is
> making a starter better than not? Less likehood of shock?

The amount of yeast they give you in a liquid product, whether it's a
White Labs vial or a WYeast pack, isn't really enough for pitching into
5 gallons of beer. They only contain around 1/4 to 1/2 the amount of a
dry yeast packet. Making a starter is so that you "grow" the population
of yeast up to the right amount before you use it.

Without a starter, you're technically underpitching using liquid yeast. That
increases the chances of things like stuck fermentations, poor attenuations
and off flavors from the yeast. The chances of those things happening also
increases with things like poor aeration and temperature control, which
beginners typically have some problems with as well. It's possible to
make a good beer without making a starter, but it will be a lot easier to
consistently make good beer if you do make one.

IMO, since you're only on your second batch I would recommend just sticking
with dry yeast. It is a lot easier to use, and is every bit as high quality
as liquid yeast. Save the liquid yeast for when you are more experienced.
There's no real reason at this point that you need to be using liquid yeast.

John.

Date: 21 Aug 2006 18:22:03
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: Liquid Yeast Storage

On Mon, 21 Aug 2006 11:05:34 -0700, <joe@gmail.com > wrote:
> Hello All,
>
> Would there be negative effects to the liquid yeast cultures if allowed
> to get to room temperature the placed back into a refrigerator?
>
> I started a batch, but aborted due to a rookie mistake, and then placed
> the liquid yeast back in the cooler after sitting out for 3 or 4 hours.
> I know temperatures above 100F is bad, but should I expect any negative
> outcomes by re-chilling it?

No, that should not have hurt the yeast at all.

John.

Date: 21 Aug 2006 18:17:08
From: Brewer Bob
Subject: Re: Liquid Yeast Storage

Date: 21 Aug 2006 13:10:37
From: The Artist Formerly Known as Kap'n Salty
Subject: Re: Liquid Yeast Storage

Joseph Love wrote:
> Hello All,
>
> Would there be negative effects to the liquid yeast cultures if allowed
> to get to room temperature the placed back into a refrigerator?
>
> I started a batch, but aborted due to a rookie mistake, and then placed
> the liquid yeast back in the cooler after sitting out for 3 or 4 hours.
> I know temperatures above 100F is bad, but should I expect any negative
> outcomes by re-chilling it?
>
> TIA,
> Joe

Storing liquid yeast cold is fine. In fact, it will last longer that
way. Pitching warm yeast into cold wort, on the otherhand, is generally
not a good idea.

--
(Replies: cleanse my address of the Mark of the Beast!)

Teleoperate a roving mobile robot from the web:
http://www.swampgas.com/robotics/rover.html

Coauthor with Dennis Clark of "Building Robot Drive Trains".
Buy several copies today!

Date: 22 Aug 2006 20:48:12
From: Andy McKellar
Subject: Re: Liquid Yeast Storage

Joseph Love wrote:
> Hello All,
>
> Would there be negative effects to the liquid yeast cultures if
> allowed to get to room temperature the placed back into a
> refrigerator?
>
> I started a batch, but aborted due to a rookie mistake, and then
> placed the liquid yeast back in the cooler after sitting out for 3 or
> 4 hours. I know temperatures above 100F is bad, but should I expect
> any negative outcomes by re-chilling it?
>

I work at our LHBS, and we routinely get deliveries from both White Labs
and Wyeast that have warmed up to (at least) room temperature during
shipment. If there have been any ill effects, they are definitely not
important in the short term. I suspect that yeast ages faster at room
temperature, but not enough faster to make a few hours, or maybe even a
few days, all that important.
--
-- Andy McKellar
Dallas, TX

Date: 23 Aug 2006 19:42:58
From: hankus
Subject: Re: Liquid Yeast Storage

10 years brewing = about 50 batches and NEVER a contamination because of
large starters that overwhelm any lapse in technique

--
Thanks
Hank
"