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Main
Date: 27 Nov 2006 01:50:30
From: Wayne
Subject: Is this possible?
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I've only just started brewing (from kits) and my second
batch is in the fermenter now. I've been using spraymalt
as the sugars to add to the kit but it's a devil to dissolve
and needs a good stirring so I was thinking of an easier
way to get things done. Now, I'm a bit of a 'hop-head' and
found my first kit lacking so I was wondering if instead
of the spraymalt I could boil-up a 1.5kg can of malt extract
with a small amount of hops for an hour, add the contents
of a kit, top up to 23 litres with cold water and pitch?
(Safale yeast) Would this work?
Bear in mind I don't have time or, more especially, space to
move up from kits right now. My preparation area is not big
enough to swing a mouse.
Cheers
Wayne
--
Registered Linux user #375994
http://www.geocities.jp/rondonko/
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Date: 27 Nov 2006 13:06:04
From: Wayne
Subject: Re: Is this possible?
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On Mon, 27 Nov 2006 05:44:04 -0700, Scott Lindner wrote:
> There's nothing wrong with what you suggest but with the concentrated wort
> your hop utilitization will be a bit off compared to others. This certainly
> is managable though. I'm going to assume you're not brewing on a regular
> basis since you sound like you're just starting out. I'd recommend buying
> some low alpha hop and use the entire 2oz in your mini boil. If you're a
> hop head, I doubt it'll be too hoppy for you. Then figure out on your own
> how hoppy you like it and adjust future batches accordingly. I suppose you
> could boil 1oz for full boil, and the other for 30 minutes.
>
> I'm curious what others have to say. I'm not a hop guy so maybe my
> suggestion is way off, but I do know what you want to do is completely
> reasonable.
>
> Scott
Thanks for your feedback, Scott. You're right about me being a noob
to this. I've only just started my second batch, which is another
kit. What I'm trying to achieve is recreate, as simply as possible,
a clone of the old UK beer called "Firkin Dogbolter" To this end I
was going to use a Black Rock bitter kit, amber LME (if I can get
any!) and Hallertau hops to give a citrus flavour to it.
I use Black Rock kits because they are the best value here, Edme
and other kits are more expensive. As you've probably read in other
posts, brewing is illegal here although it's legal to sell kits so
there is only a small fraction of ingredients and hardware on the
market.
I will do as you suggest and just experiment, even if the first
one does come out too hoppy I don't think it will be undrinkable!
:-)
Wayne
--
Registered Linux user #375994
http://www.geocities.jp/rondonko/
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Date: 27 Nov 2006 07:27:42
From: Scott Lindner
Subject: Re: Is this possible?
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> I will do as you suggest and just experiment, even if the first
> one does come out too hoppy I don't think it will be undrinkable!
Post the details of your recipe/kit and the total volume of the boil, and
total volume in the fermenter and I'll try to run some calcs tonight to give
you a good idea about how hoppy this would be based on a few hop types. Do
you know what hops you have available to you?
Scott
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Date: 27 Nov 2006 05:44:04
From: Scott Lindner
Subject: Re: Is this possible?
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There's nothing wrong with what you suggest but with the concentrated wort
your hop utilitization will be a bit off compared to others. This certainly
is managable though. I'm going to assume you're not brewing on a regular
basis since you sound like you're just starting out. I'd recommend buying
some low alpha hop and use the entire 2oz in your mini boil. If you're a
hop head, I doubt it'll be too hoppy for you. Then figure out on your own
how hoppy you like it and adjust future batches accordingly. I suppose you
could boil 1oz for full boil, and the other for 30 minutes.
I'm curious what others have to say. I'm not a hop guy so maybe my
suggestion is way off, but I do know what you want to do is completely
reasonable.
Scott
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Date: 28 Nov 2006 00:50:44
From: Wayne
Subject: Re: Is this possible?
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On Mon, 27 Nov 2006 18:10:42 -0600, David M. Taylor wrote:
> Yep, I think that would work quite nicely. When I was doing extract
> batches, I'd put all the extract, hopped and unhopped, into the kettle at
> the same time and boil for anywhere from 15 to 60 minutes. But your idea
> will work probably even better. By conserving the kit until the end of
> the boil, it won't darken as much. If color makes any difference to you
> at all, then that's a good way to go.
Thanks, I was hoping it would. Basic kits are OK but lack the hoppiness
I like and I thought this would be a good way to improve on them. Once
I feel confident enough doing this I want to move up to extract. One
step at a time, eh?
Cheers
Wayne
--
Registered Linux user #375994
http://www.geocities.jp/rondonko/
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Date: 27 Nov 2006 18:10:42
From: David M. Taylor
Subject: Re: Is this possible?
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"Wayne" <rondonjin@yahoo.com > wrote in message
news:ekdg96$so6$4@registered.motzarella.org...
> I've only just started brewing (from kits) and my second
> batch is in the fermenter now. I've been using spraymalt
> as the sugars to add to the kit but it's a devil to dissolve
> and needs a good stirring so I was thinking of an easier
> way to get things done. Now, I'm a bit of a 'hop-head' and
> found my first kit lacking so I was wondering if instead
> of the spraymalt I could boil-up a 1.5kg can of malt extract
> with a small amount of hops for an hour, add the contents
> of a kit, top up to 23 litres with cold water and pitch?
> (Safale yeast) Would this work?
>
> Bear in mind I don't have time or, more especially, space to
> move up from kits right now. My preparation area is not big
> enough to swing a mouse.
Yep, I think that would work quite nicely. When I was doing extract
batches, I'd put all the extract, hopped and unhopped, into the kettle at
the same time and boil for anywhere from 15 to 60 minutes. But your idea
will work probably even better. By conserving the kit until the end of the
boil, it won't darken as much. If color makes any difference to you at all,
then that's a good way to go.
--
Dave
"Fill your cup with whatever bitter brew you're drinking." -- Brad Paisley
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Date: 27 Nov 2006 23:18:04
From: Wayne
Subject: Re: Is this possible?
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On Mon, 27 Nov 2006 21:19:23 +0000, John 'Shaggy' Kolesar wrote:
> Sure, dry malt extract (DME, spraymalt, etc) is basically the same thing
> as liquid malt extract (LME, syrup, etc). Assuming that they're both the
> same kind (light, amber, dark, etc), then the only thing you really need
> to worry about is the substitution rate. LME is basically 20% water, so
> take that into account when converting to DME. IOW, if the recipe calls
> for a certain amount of DME, and you want to use LME instead, then use
> 1.25 times as much. Going the other way, if the recipe originally called
> for LME and you want to use DME, then use .80 times as much.
Thanks for the simple explanation. I'm planning on trying this after
I have one more kit done and when I feel confident enough.
Cheers
Wayne
--
Registered Linux user #375994
http://www.geocities.jp/rondonko/
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Date: 27 Nov 2006 23:15:47
From: Wayne
Subject: Re: Is this possible?
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On Mon, 27 Nov 2006 07:27:42 -0700, Scott Lindner wrote:
>> I will do as you suggest and just experiment, even if the first
>> one does come out too hoppy I don't think it will be undrinkable!
>
> Post the details of your recipe/kit and the total volume of the boil, and
> total volume in the fermenter and I'll try to run some calcs tonight to give
> you a good idea about how hoppy this would be based on a few hop types. Do
> you know what hops you have available to you?
>
> Scott
Details are a bit sketchy. The kit is by Black Rock in NZ. It's
their New Zealand Company Bitter, made with Two Row Malted Barley
and Nelson Hops. It's a 1.7Kg kit. I want to use some form of
amber LME which I will boil for an hour in 6 litres of water (I
don't have a pot larger) The only hops that I can walk into a
store and buy are Young's Fuggles and Saaz. I want to use Hallertau
though, which I can order from a store in Kobe but will be pellets.
The total volume in the fermenter will be 23 litres.
To show you all what the situation is like I'll post this URL.
This place actually has a good selection! For here, that is :-)
http://www.bcjkobe.com/english/index.htm
Cheers
Wayne
--
Registered Linux user #375994
http://www.geocities.jp/rondonko/
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Date: 30 Nov 2006 09:47:38
From: M Lawson
Subject: Re: Is this possible?
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Hi Wayne,
A msg from NZ (home of Black Rock gear).
Here's the blurb from a book I have on Safale S-04:
"this well known English ale yeast used widely by commercial breweries in
the UK and Europe. Beers made with S-04 have good ale flavours with a
pleasant aroma. It ferments very quickly and forms a compact sediment in the
fermenter and the bottle that is not easily disturbed making beer very easy
to pour.
* Recommended fermentation temperature: 15C - 24C
* Sedimentation: high
* Final gravity: medium. "
With regards your hop-head tendancy, I think that you'd enjoy something like
an English bitter. The Black Rock New Zealand Co Bitter is described as:
" This is a medium dark amber beer with strong bitterness. It has a rich
malt character with a big hop aftertaste.
* EBC 25, IBU 30 "
I'm assuming that you're after that after-taste that lingers for ages and
has you smacking your lips with enjoyment?
I recently visited a micro-brewery in Christchurch where they give a tour.
As luck would have it, the manager couldn't give the tour so the actual
brewer gave his very first tour. He let slip a few things about their bitter
(very hoppy and bloody nice!). From memory, one of the hops they used was
either fuggles or goldings...
Skimming through some bitter recipies to convert kits that the book contains
(Brewing Crafts ISBN 0-9756761-0-5 by Blackson books), Goldings hops and
Safale seem to be the predominant hops and yeast used for English bitters.
Fuggles features in a number of English ale recipies but not to the same
extent as goldings. The Kilkenny clone (Irish red) has both...
I hink I saw in an earlier post of yours that you're keen on something
called Dogbolter? Zee book has a recipie for something called Ridgeback
Dogbolter.
It's described as a very strong ale, full of body and flavour and plenty of
alcohol (about 7-8%)
Ingredients:
* Brewcraft Newcastle Brown Ale kit
* Dark dry malt extract 1kg
* Muntons Gold Yeast
Notes:
* Final volume 14 litres
* OG 1065, FG 1018, Alc 7%
* When bottling, use 3/4 of the usual bottling sugar.
Hope this all aids to your eventual 'merryment'.
Mike
"Wayne" <rondonjin@yahoo.com > wrote in message
news:ekfrj3$djq$1@registered.motzarella.org...
> On Mon, 27 Nov 2006 07:27:42 -0700, Scott Lindner wrote:
>
> >> I will do as you suggest and just experiment, even if the first
> >> one does come out too hoppy I don't think it will be undrinkable!
> >
> > Post the details of your recipe/kit and the total volume of the boil,
and
> > total volume in the fermenter and I'll try to run some calcs tonight to
give
> > you a good idea about how hoppy this would be based on a few hop types.
Do
> > you know what hops you have available to you?
> >
> > Scott
>
> Details are a bit sketchy. The kit is by Black Rock in NZ. It's
> their New Zealand Company Bitter, made with Two Row Malted Barley
> and Nelson Hops. It's a 1.7Kg kit. I want to use some form of
> amber LME which I will boil for an hour in 6 litres of water (I
> don't have a pot larger) The only hops that I can walk into a
> store and buy are Young's Fuggles and Saaz. I want to use Hallertau
> though, which I can order from a store in Kobe but will be pellets.
> The total volume in the fermenter will be 23 litres.
>
> To show you all what the situation is like I'll post this URL.
> This place actually has a good selection! For here, that is :-)
>
> http://www.bcjkobe.com/english/index.htm
>
> Cheers
>
> Wayne
> --
> Registered Linux user #375994
> http://www.geocities.jp/rondonko/
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Date: 27 Nov 2006 21:19:23
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: Is this possible?
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On Mon, 27 Nov 2006 01:50:30 +0000 (UTC), <rondonjin@yahoo.com > wrote:
> I've only just started brewing (from kits) and my second
> batch is in the fermenter now. I've been using spraymalt
> as the sugars to add to the kit but it's a devil to dissolve
> and needs a good stirring so I was thinking of an easier
> way to get things done. Now, I'm a bit of a 'hop-head' and
> found my first kit lacking so I was wondering if instead
> of the spraymalt I could boil-up a 1.5kg can of malt extract
> with a small amount of hops for an hour, add the contents
> of a kit, top up to 23 litres with cold water and pitch?
> (Safale yeast) Would this work?
Sure, dry malt extract (DME, spraymalt, etc) is basically the same thing
as liquid malt extract (LME, syrup, etc). Assuming that they're both the
same kind (light, amber, dark, etc), then the only thing you really need
to worry about is the substitution rate. LME is basically 20% water, so
take that into account when converting to DME. IOW, if the recipe calls for
a certain amount of DME, and you want to use LME instead, then use 1.25
times as much. Going the other way, if the recipe originally called for
LME and you want to use DME, then use .80 times as much.
John.
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Date: 29 Nov 2006 22:45:13
From: Wayne
Subject: Re: Is this possible?
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On Thu, 30 Nov 2006 09:47:38 +1300, M Lawson wrote:
Hi Mike,
> A msg from NZ (home of Black Rock gear).
Chilly greetings from Tokyo.
> Here's the blurb from a book I have on Safale S-04:
>
> "this well known English ale yeast used widely by commercial breweries in
> the UK and Europe. Beers made with S-04 have good ale flavours with a
> pleasant aroma. It ferments very quickly and forms a compact sediment in
> the fermenter and the bottle that is not easily disturbed making beer very
> easy to pour.
> * Recommended fermentation temperature: 15C - 24C * Sedimentation: high
> * Final gravity: medium. "
Yes, I found this blurb while skimming the net. Looks good to me!
> With regards your hop-head tendancy, I think that you'd enjoy something
> like an English bitter. The Black Rock New Zealand Co Bitter is described
> as: " This is a medium dark amber beer with strong bitterness. It has a
> rich malt character with a big hop aftertaste. * EBC 25, IBU 30 "
I'm a Brit and do enjoy a nice bitter and the Black Rock Bitter you
mention was the first kit I tried. It was a semi-success as I misread
the thermometer and pitched the yeast too hot. I'm definitely going
to try it again though as I'm sure it would have been nicer if I'd
done things right and next time I'll use the Safale.
> I'm assuming that you're after that after-taste that lingers for ages
> and has you smacking your lips with enjoyment?
You got it in one! :-)
Thanks for the rest of the message, especially the recipe for
Dogbolter. I've put it in my 'saved' folder for later.
Cheers
Wayne
--
Registered Linux user #375994
http://www.geocities.jp/rondonko/
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