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Date: 16 Sep 2006 17:33:08
From: Don Levey
Subject: Gelatin fining for kegged porters/stouts
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Looking through the Northern Brewer catalog this afternoon, I noticed
that they list gelatin as not only a fining agent but something which
can be used to reduce tannins. This interests me, as I suspect that
both the porter I'm about to keg and the stout I need to keg next week
extracted a bit too much tannin (due to grain chunks in the boil). I'd
love to bring some of that out.
The problem is that both are already in the secondary. I suppose that
for the porter I could add the gelatin/water mixture as I'm kegging,
and draw off the sediment with the first pint. But for the stout,
should I just plan on the same or should I add it to the secondary
already in progress so as to not transfer it to the keg in the first
place? I am concerned about opening the secondary vessel any more
than necessary, but want to do the best possible for the beer. Any
thoughts?
--
Don Levey $ cd /pub
Framingham, MA $ more beer
NOTE: email server uses spam filters; mail sent to salearn@the-leveys.us
will be used to tune the blocking lists.
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Date: 18 Sep 2006 15:31:38
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: Gelatin fining for kegged porters/stouts
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On 16 Sep 2006 17:33:08 -0400, <Don_RCB@the-leveys.us > wrote:
> Looking through the Northern Brewer catalog this afternoon, I noticed
> that they list gelatin as not only a fining agent but something which
> can be used to reduce tannins. This interests me, as I suspect that
> both the porter I'm about to keg and the stout I need to keg next week
> extracted a bit too much tannin (due to grain chunks in the boil). I'd
> love to bring some of that out.
There's probably a relationship there between clarity and tannins. Generally
the tannins will bind with proteins (which is one thing that happens during
the break). So, it makes sense that if you're fining to remove protein
haze, you're probably going to be reducing tannins as well. IE, most
likely they're going to settle out together, at least to some degree. Will
this procedure cut back significantly on a beer with astringency problems?
I don't know. Probably some, but you'll still likely need some aging to
help as well.
> The problem is that both are already in the secondary. I suppose that
> for the porter I could add the gelatin/water mixture as I'm kegging,
> and draw off the sediment with the first pint. But for the stout,
> should I just plan on the same or should I add it to the secondary
> already in progress so as to not transfer it to the keg in the first
> place? I am concerned about opening the secondary vessel any more
> than necessary, but want to do the best possible for the beer. Any
> thoughts?
I think you could add it to the secondary, or even wait until the secondary
is over if you really wanted to, and do your fining in a tertiary before
kegging. I wouldn't worry too much about opening the secondary though, it
shouldn't really cause a problem.
John.
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Date: 18 Sep 2006 18:07:47
From: David M. Taylor
Subject: Re: Gelatin fining for kegged porters/stouts
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"John 'Shaggy' Kolesar" <spam@shagg.net > wrote in message
news:slrnegtf4t.tua.spam@weizen.shagg.net...
> On 16 Sep 2006 17:33:08 -0400, <Don_RCB@the-leveys.us> wrote:
>> Looking through the Northern Brewer catalog this afternoon, I noticed
>> that they list gelatin as not only a fining agent but something which
>> can be used to reduce tannins. This interests me, as I suspect that
>> both the porter I'm about to keg and the stout I need to keg next week
>> extracted a bit too much tannin (due to grain chunks in the boil). I'd
>> love to bring some of that out.
>
> There's probably a relationship there between clarity and tannins.
> Generally
> the tannins will bind with proteins (which is one thing that happens
> during
> the break). So, it makes sense that if you're fining to remove protein
> haze, you're probably going to be reducing tannins as well. IE, most
> likely they're going to settle out together, at least to some degree.
> Will
> this procedure cut back significantly on a beer with astringency problems?
> I don't know. Probably some, but you'll still likely need some aging to
> help as well.
I am by no means an expert, but the way I've got it memorized in my own
brain is this:
Irish moss helps prevent protein haze.
Gelatin gets rid of yeast or bacteria haze.
Polyclar gets rid of tannins, which reacts with protein to cause chill haze.
And of course, if you use all three, well then your beer should be so bright
it glows.
In your case, whether it be haze or astringency, my wager would be to try
Polyclar. Polyclar, time, and cold should minimize your tannin issue. It
may not eliminate your problem altogether, but it in theory it should get it
the best it can be.
--
Dave
"Just a drink, a little drink, and I'll be feeling GOOooOOooOOooD!" --
Genesis, 1973-ish
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Date: 19 Sep 2006 02:24:27
From: Steve/Aus
Subject: Re: Gelatin fining for kegged porters/stouts
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"David M. Taylor" <dmtaylor@SPAM.geocities.SUCKS.com > wrote in message
news:uIFPg.47$_h1.8@newsfe04.lga...
> "John 'Shaggy' Kolesar" <spam@shagg.net> wrote in message
> news:slrnegtf4t.tua.spam@weizen.shagg.net...
>
> Irish moss helps prevent protein haze.
> Gelatin gets rid of yeast or bacteria haze.
> Polyclar gets rid of tannins, which reacts with protein to cause chill
> haze.
>
> And of course, if you use all three, well then your beer should be so
> bright it glows.
>
> In your case, whether it be haze or astringency, my wager would be to try
> Polyclar. Polyclar, time, and cold should minimize your tannin issue. It
> may not eliminate your problem altogether, but it in theory it should get
> it the best it can be.
>
> --
> Dave
Of course, gelatin is almost pure protein in itself.
So using protein to get rid of protein - that's interesting
Steve W (in Aus)
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