| |
Main
Date: 03 Oct 2006 12:40:06
From: Jim
Subject: Feedback on planned Pumpkin Ale please!!?
|
I am planning on brewing a pumpkin ale soon so I thought I would post
my ideas here to see if I get any feedback.
First of all I've read the debates on whether or not it is necessary to
actually use pumpkin when brewing a pumpkin ale. Personally I just
wouldn't feel right calling it such if it did not contain any pumpkin
so I will be actually using the vegetable itself. I realize I may
regret this later but I'm prepared to face the consequences :P
I have purchased 5 small *pie* pumpkins. In preperation for brewing I
plan on halving, seeding and deveining these and baking them at 350 for
about an hour or until they start to collapse from softness. At this
point I will let them cool and remove the meat and mash it up (as in
mashed potatoes).
The All-Grain batches I've done so far have been single infusion with a
batch sparge. About as simple as you can get really. My whole process
is pretty much duplicated from http://cruisenews.net/brewing/infusion/
. My mash tun is identical to that, etc. I guess my first question
would be do you think I would experience any problems with protiens,
startches, etc. from doing this sort of mash with pumpkin. I would like
to have some body to this beer so I was planning on mashing for 60
minutes at 155 or so.
The Grain bill is as follows:
7lbs Maris Otter
2lbs Wheat Malt
1lb Crystal 40L
.25lbs Chocolate Malt
1lb Rice Hulls
Flesh of 5 small pie pumpkins
I was planning on basically just throwing this stuff in the tun,
dumping in my strike water, stir it up good and let it mash. Then the
normal vorlauf routine, dumping in my sparge water, stir it up and
drain again and start my boil.
Hop schedule is simple:
1oz Hallertau 60 min
1oz Hallertau 10 min
My last concern is spicing. I've had a few pumpkin ales at a local
brew-fest and all of them seemed under-bodied and over spiced. Sort of
like drinking a cold spice tea (blech). My goal is for the spicing to
be very subtle. If at all possible I would like to add spices to the
boil. I know that creating a "Spice Tea" from the spices and vodka
would be more precise but I really don't feel like fanagaling with it
at that point.
I guess I'm asking what are people's experiences with adding the spices
directly to the boil? At what time do you add yours and in what
measurements?
I'll be pitching a starter of White Labs English Ale.
Basically anything you can point out now so I don't stumble with it on
brew day would be great.
Thanks!
|
|
| |
Date: 03 Oct 2006 23:51:33
From: Kyle
Subject: Re: Feedback on planned Pumpkin Ale please!!?
|
Overall it sounds like a good plan. Five small pie pumpkins may be a
tad much. Both this and last year I used three pie pumpkins, about 8
pounds in total. After quartering and baking at 350F for two hours I
came out with 2.5 lb (last year) / 3 lb (this year) of pumpkin meat to
add to the mash.
Last year I added no spices and used a rather basic ESB recipe. The
pumpkin flavor was subtle but definitely there. Oh-- one more thing,
last year I added the pumpkin guts and seeds to the mash as well. I
think it was another pound or so pound and a half of material there.
This year I did a Belgian style. I didn't add the guts/seeds like
last year, but I've got more pumpkin meat. Oddly, my efficiency was
only about 60% instead of my usual 75%. I think I sparged too quick.
This brew is still bubbling away in the primary, I'll transfer and try
it out late this week.
One final thing-- you might want to do a starch test with your mash.
You're using Maris Otter, which purportedly isn't all that hot for
diastatic power. All that pumpkin will need some enzymes to get its
starches converted. You may need a longer mash or some extra ooomph
to convert all those starches. Or you might consider using a
different base malt, or even mixing 50/50 Maris Otter with standard
2-row. Then again, you may not run into any problems either...
-Kyle
In article <1159904406.641134.261750@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com >,
Jim <formatreinstall@gmail.com > wrote:
>I am planning on brewing a pumpkin ale soon so I thought I would post
>my ideas here to see if I get any feedback.
>
>First of all I've read the debates on whether or not it is necessary to
>actually use pumpkin when brewing a pumpkin ale. Personally I just
>wouldn't feel right calling it such if it did not contain any pumpkin
>so I will be actually using the vegetable itself. I realize I may
>regret this later but I'm prepared to face the consequences :P
>
>I have purchased 5 small *pie* pumpkins. In preperation for brewing I
>plan on halving, seeding and deveining these and baking them at 350 for
>about an hour or until they start to collapse from softness. At this
>point I will let them cool and remove the meat and mash it up (as in
>mashed potatoes).
>
>The All-Grain batches I've done so far have been single infusion with a
>batch sparge. About as simple as you can get really. My whole process
>is pretty much duplicated from http://cruisenews.net/brewing/infusion/
>. My mash tun is identical to that, etc. I guess my first question
>would be do you think I would experience any problems with protiens,
>startches, etc. from doing this sort of mash with pumpkin. I would like
>to have some body to this beer so I was planning on mashing for 60
>minutes at 155 or so.
>
>The Grain bill is as follows:
>
>7lbs Maris Otter
>2lbs Wheat Malt
>1lb Crystal 40L
>.25lbs Chocolate Malt
>1lb Rice Hulls
>Flesh of 5 small pie pumpkins
>
>I was planning on basically just throwing this stuff in the tun,
>dumping in my strike water, stir it up good and let it mash. Then the
>normal vorlauf routine, dumping in my sparge water, stir it up and
>drain again and start my boil.
>
>Hop schedule is simple:
>
>1oz Hallertau 60 min
>1oz Hallertau 10 min
>
>My last concern is spicing. I've had a few pumpkin ales at a local
>brew-fest and all of them seemed under-bodied and over spiced. Sort of
>like drinking a cold spice tea (blech). My goal is for the spicing to
>be very subtle. If at all possible I would like to add spices to the
>boil. I know that creating a "Spice Tea" from the spices and vodka
>would be more precise but I really don't feel like fanagaling with it
>at that point.
>
>I guess I'm asking what are people's experiences with adding the spices
>directly to the boil? At what time do you add yours and in what
>measurements?
>
>I'll be pitching a starter of White Labs English Ale.
>
>Basically anything you can point out now so I don't stumble with it on
>brew day would be great.
>
>Thanks!
>
|
| |
Date: 03 Oct 2006 14:34:24
From: Jim
Subject: Re: Feedback on planned Pumpkin Ale please!!?
|
> > I guess I'm asking what are people's experiences with adding the spices
> > directly to the boil? At what time do you add yours and in what
> > measurements?
>
> This is where the refraining part comes in. ;)
>
> If you really want to spice it, in general I would suggest adding spices
> to the secondary. If you add them during the boil you're only going to
> drive off a lot of the flavor/aroma. Are you planning on using a pre-made
> "pumpkin pie spice" or are you going to be combining individual spices
> yourself?
So you do the vodka spice thing and measure it out and add it before
kegging? I know that would be the best way to get the amount of spicing
I'm going for but it seems like a pretty big hassle.
Could you give me some more info about your process?
I picked up a jar of "Pumpkin Pie Spice" but if somebody had a break
down of what whole spices, etc they use I wouldn't be opposed to trying
something like that. Eventually I'll have my own grinder for fresh
spices, etc but I'm not there yet :)
Thanks for your time bro!
|
| | |
Date: 04 Oct 2006 15:47:24
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: Feedback on planned Pumpkin Ale please!!?
|
On 3 2006 14:34:24 -0700, <formatreinstall@gmail.com > wrote:
>> > I guess I'm asking what are people's experiences with adding the spices
>> > directly to the boil? At what time do you add yours and in what
>> > measurements?
>>
>> This is where the refraining part comes in. ;)
>>
>> If you really want to spice it, in general I would suggest adding spices
>> to the secondary. If you add them during the boil you're only going to
>> drive off a lot of the flavor/aroma. Are you planning on using a pre-made
>> "pumpkin pie spice" or are you going to be combining individual spices
>> yourself?
>
> So you do the vodka spice thing and measure it out and add it before
> kegging? I know that would be the best way to get the amount of spicing
> I'm going for but it seems like a pretty big hassle.
>
> Could you give me some more info about your process?
Well, I don't spice mine (at least not if I'm using real pumpkin, I
occasionally make it without any pumpkin and spice that one) but I would
just add the spices directly to the secondary. No vodka, etc. Just toss
the spices in the carboy/bucket and rack on top of them.
John.
|
| |
Date: 03 Oct 2006 20:20:18
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: Feedback on planned Pumpkin Ale please!!?
|
On 3 2006 12:40:06 -0700, <formatreinstall@gmail.com > wrote:
> First of all I've read the debates on whether or not it is necessary to
> actually use pumpkin when brewing a pumpkin ale. Personally I just
> wouldn't feel right calling it such if it did not contain any pumpkin
> so I will be actually using the vegetable itself. I realize I may
> regret this later but I'm prepared to face the consequences :P
I'll refrain from any comments along those lines then. ;)
> My mash tun is identical to that, etc. I guess my first question
> would be do you think I would experience any problems with protiens,
> startches, etc. from doing this sort of mash with pumpkin. I would like
> to have some body to this beer so I was planning on mashing for 60
> minutes at 155 or so.
The only comment I have about mashing/sparging is to be prepared for a
very slow (possibly stuck) sparge. The pumpkin makes the grain bed *really*
sticky. Usually a "normal" beer takes me about 45 minutes to sparge (I fly
sparge). However, a pumpkin beer takes me 3 hours or so to sparge. Just
be ready for that when you are planning out your day.
> 1lb Rice Hulls
I don't generally use rice hulls, but maybe it will help with the
sparge issues. IMO, it's probably a pretty good idea to include them.
> Flesh of 5 small pie pumpkins
I usually use Libby's canned pumpkin. IMO, it's just easier than trying
to deal with whole pumpkins yourself.
> I guess I'm asking what are people's experiences with adding the spices
> directly to the boil? At what time do you add yours and in what
> measurements?
This is where the refraining part comes in. ;)
If you really want to spice it, in general I would suggest adding spices
to the secondary. If you add them during the boil you're only going to
drive off a lot of the flavor/aroma. Are you planning on using a pre-made
"pumpkin pie spice" or are you going to be combining individual spices
yourself?
> Basically anything you can point out now so I don't stumble with it on
> brew day would be great.
Be prepared for a slow sparge, other than that it should be like any other
all grain beer. I've never used whole pumpkin before though, so there may
be a few pitfalls involved with that which I'm unaware of.
John.
|
| |
Date: 04 Oct 2006 08:13:30
From: Randal
Subject: Re: Feedback on planned Pumpkin Ale please!!?
|
Jim wrote:
> I picked up a jar of "Pumpkin Pie Spice" but if somebody had a break
> down of what whole spices, etc they use I wouldn't be opposed to trying
> something like that. Eventually I'll have my own grinder for fresh
> spices, etc but I'm not there yet :)
>
I use a spice combination that I got from Cooks magazine and it turns
out great every year (I make a pumpkin porter):
2 tbs + 1 tsp cinnamon
1 tbs nutmeg (I but the whole nutmegs and grind them - usually one is
more than enough for 1 tablespoon)
2 tsp ground ginger
1 tsp allspice
I add this with about 3 minutes left in the boil and I end up with a
nice spice that is a little on the light side. Remember - when adding
powdered spices to the boil, kill the heat before you add them because
it will cause a volcano boil over otherwise!
_Randal
|
| |
Date: 04 Oct 2006 12:28:43
From: OrganicVeggie
Subject: Re: Feedback on planned Pumpkin Ale please!!?
|
Jim wrote:
> First of all I've read the debates on whether or not it is necessary to
> actually use pumpkin when brewing a pumpkin ale. Personally I just
> wouldn't feel right calling it such if it did not contain any pumpkin
> so I will be actually using the vegetable itself. I realize I may
> regret this later but I'm prepared to face the consequences :P
I added mine to the boil, which I definitely regretted since it
absorbed a large amount of spices. On the plus side, the pumpkin tasted
delicious. :) And yes, I'm now one of those who swears that you don't
need pumpkin to create a pumpkin ale. *laugh* But more power to you if
you want to try it out.
> I have purchased 5 small *pie* pumpkins. In preperation for brewing I
> plan on halving, seeding and deveining these and baking them at 350 for
> about an hour or until they start to collapse from softness.
For a 10 gallon batch I used roughly 10 pounds of pie pumpkins, baked
at 350F for about an hour.
> My last concern is spicing. I've had a few pumpkin ales at a local
> brew-fest and all of them seemed under-bodied and over spiced. Sort of
> like drinking a cold spice tea (blech). My goal is for the spicing to
> be very subtle. If at all possible I would like to add spices to the
> boil. I know that creating a "Spice Tea" from the spices and vodka
> would be more precise but I really don't feel like fanagaling with it
> at that point.
I initially just added spices to the boil (no problems with volcanoes
or boil-overs) for the last 5 minutes. Since the pumpkin absorbed a lot
of spices, I felt adding additional spices to the secondary was
necessary. Here's what I added to the kettle and to secondary for my 10
gallon batch:
Kettle Addition (last 5 mins):
2 tsp cinnamon
1 tsp nutmeg
1 tsp ginger
1/2 tsp pumpkin pie spice
Secondary:
4x cinnamon sticks
1x vanilla bean, split
When I transferred to secondary, the cinnamon note was almost
non-existant, which is why I added the cinnamon sticks. There was a
hint of nutmeg and clove, so I left that alone. I'm guessing that if
you utilized the pumpkin the mash, instead of the boil, the spices
would be stronger but I suspect they would still be subtle. YMMV.
Good luck!
-Sean
---
I've had a perfectly wonderful evening. But this wasn't it.
--- Groucho Marx
|
| |
Date: 05 Oct 2006 15:39:40
From: Adam Preble
Subject: Re: Feedback on planned Pumpkin Ale please!!?
|
Jim wrote:
> I guess I'm asking what are people's experiences with adding the spices
> directly to the boil? At what time do you add yours and in what
> measurements?
I can indirectly answer by sharing my experience with doing this in
secondary. The cinnamon reacted with the beer in an odd way, and I got
something like a cola taste. It was neat, but unpleasant in a whole
pint. That's mellowed out over the last year, but the beer isn't much
of a keeper to me. I spiced in the secondary.
I'm thinking now that the spices in this case should go into the boil
towards the end, although you'll probably need to use quite a bit. I
believe the presence of the spices by themselves doesn't give the pie
flavor, but rather cooking the spices down a little bit gets you there.
I don't think I'm going to do a pumpkin beer this year, but I would
boil the spices next time. This is in spite of me spicing in the
secondary for just about everything else.
|
| | |
Date: 05 Oct 2006 15:43:48
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: Feedback on planned Pumpkin Ale please!!?
|
On Thu, 05 2006 15:39:40 GMT, <rockobonaparte@hotmail.com > wrote:
> Jim wrote:
>
>> I guess I'm asking what are people's experiences with adding the spices
>> directly to the boil? At what time do you add yours and in what
>> measurements?
>
> I can indirectly answer by sharing my experience with doing this in
> secondary. The cinnamon reacted with the beer in an odd way, and I got
> something like a cola taste. It was neat, but unpleasant in a whole
> pint. That's mellowed out over the last year, but the beer isn't much
> of a keeper to me. I spiced in the secondary.
>
> I'm thinking now that the spices in this case should go into the boil
> towards the end, although you'll probably need to use quite a bit. I
> believe the presence of the spices by themselves doesn't give the pie
> flavor, but rather cooking the spices down a little bit gets you there.
> I don't think I'm going to do a pumpkin beer this year, but I would
> boil the spices next time. This is in spite of me spicing in the
> secondary for just about everything else.
That's interesting. I can't say what happened in your case, but I've had
the opposite experience. I spiced mine in the secondary and it tasted
fine, just like a pumpkin pie. Were you using a pre-packaged pumpkin pie
spice, or were you combining the individual spices yourself? I'm not sure
what difference that would make, just curious.
John.
|
|
