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Main
Date: 10 Aug 2006 14:57:04
From: David Wuertele
Subject: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
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After transfering my wort from the kettle to the primary, it is at
68F, and I stick in a sanitized paint mixer chucked into an electric
drill and squeeze the trigger for about three minutes. This aerates
the bejezus out of the wort, and results in a pretty deep foam sitting
on top of the wort. Normally I pitch a vial of liquid yeast (no
starter) into this, and I have no problems. The liquid goes right
through the foam into the wort.
Now I would like to try some dry yeast. But if I sprinkle the dry
yeast on top of my aerated wort, it will probably just sit on top of
the foam and not make it to the wort until the foam subsides. I have
no idea what effect this might have. Which of these options would be
the best way to proceed:
1. don't worry, just sprinkle the dry yeast on top of the foam
2. sprinkle the yeast on the wort *before* aerating
3. use a different method of aeration that doesn't create foam on top
of the wort
4. reconstitute the yeast in liquid before pitching
5. (fill in the blank) ____________________________
My intuition says that #2 will be fine, and is my best option.
Dave
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Date: 11 Aug 2006 02:48:15
From: Thomas Adams
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
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"David Wuertele" <dave-gnus@bfnet.com > wrote in message
news:m3irl0p83z.fsf@bfnet.com...
> After transfering my wort from the kettle to the primary, it is at
> 68F, and I stick in a sanitized paint mixer chucked into an electric
> drill and squeeze the trigger for about three minutes. This aerates
> the bejezus out of the wort, and results in a pretty deep foam sitting
> on top of the wort. Normally I pitch a vial of liquid yeast (no
> starter) into this, and I have no problems. The liquid goes right
> through the foam into the wort.
>
> Now I would like to try some dry yeast. But if I sprinkle the dry
> yeast on top of my aerated wort, it will probably just sit on top of
> the foam and not make it to the wort until the foam subsides. I have
> no idea what effect this might have. Which of these options would be
> the best way to proceed:
>
> 1. don't worry, just sprinkle the dry yeast on top of the foam
>
> 2. sprinkle the yeast on the wort *before* aerating
>
> 3. use a different method of aeration that doesn't create foam on top
> of the wort
>
> 4. reconstitute the yeast in liquid before pitching
>
> 5. (fill in the blank) ____________________________
>
>
> My intuition says that #2 will be fine, and is my best option.
>
> Dave
The few times that I have used dry yeast in beer I followed the package
directions and rehydrated the yeast in warm water. After doing this and then
pitching it the lag time is a whole lot shorter than with liquid yeast. This
has caused me to try rehydrating with my wine yeast when fermenting meads
and they start within several hours.
--
Thomas Cameron Adams
imcelt2@redrivercamerons.org
darkhorsebrewing@verizon.net
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Date: 10 Aug 2006 17:52:35
From: David Wuertele
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
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John > I think he just means that he pitches half way through aeration.
OK. Do you think it hurts the yeast if I beat it with a paint stirrer
at 1000 RPM?
Dave
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Date: 10 Aug 2006 18:45:31
From: Wheat
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
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"David Wuertele" <dave-gnus@bfnet.com > wrote in message
news:m3lkpwm6uk.fsf@bfnet.com...
> John> I think he just means that he pitches half way through aeration.
>
> OK. Do you think it hurts the yeast if I beat it with a paint stirrer
> at 1000 RPM?
>
> Dave
I've been following this interesting discussion on aeration and pitching
yeast.
Here is an an article that I found written by John Palmer that address's
both:
http://www.howtobrew.com/section1/chapter6-9-3.html
Bill
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Date: 10 Aug 2006 17:52:15
From: David Wuertele
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
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John > I think he just means that he pitches half way through aeration.
OK. Do you think it hurts the yeast if I beat it with a paint stirrer
at 1000 RPM?
Dave
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Date: 11 Aug 2006 01:20:54
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
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On Thu, 10 Aug 2006 17:52:15 -0700, <dave@rokulabs.com > wrote:
> John> I think he just means that he pitches half way through aeration.
>
> OK. Do you think it hurts the yeast if I beat it with a paint stirrer
> at 1000 RPM?
It's possible in theory. I don't know for sure though. For example, I
know that it's possible to damage yeast cells in a flask on a stir plate
if you run the stir bar too fast. Given that the volume is *much* larger
when you aerate your wort in a carboy/bucket I don't know if the paint
stirrer will do any damage. Gut instinct tells me that it's doubtful, but
I usually add my yeast after aerating with a Mix-stir just incase.
John.
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Date: 11 Aug 2006 15:05:51
From: John Bleichert
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
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John 'Shaggy' Kolesar <spam@shagg.net > wrote:
> On Thu, 10 Aug 2006 17:52:15 -0700, <dave@rokulabs.com> wrote:
>> John> I think he just means that he pitches half way through aeration.
>>
>> OK. Do you think it hurts the yeast if I beat it with a paint stirrer
>> at 1000 RPM?
>
> It's possible in theory. I don't know for sure though. For example, I
> know that it's possible to damage yeast cells in a flask on a stir plate
> if you run the stir bar too fast. Given that the volume is *much* larger
> when you aerate your wort in a carboy/bucket I don't know if the paint
> stirrer will do any damage. Gut instinct tells me that it's doubtful, but
> I usually add my yeast after aerating with a Mix-stir just incase.
>
>
> John.
I aerate with my power drill, pitch the yeast, and then at slow RPM
just mix it in real quick. No problems so far.
-----------------------------------------------
John Bleichert syborg@earthlink.net
The heat from below can burn your eyes out!!
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Date: 11 Aug 2006 16:09:23
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
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On Fri, 11 Aug 2006 15:05:51 GMT, <syborg@earthlink.net > wrote:
> I aerate with my power drill, pitch the yeast, and then at slow RPM
> just mix it in real quick. No problems so far.
This is one of those moments when you just want to smack your head and
say "Duh!". I'd never thought of that before. I always aerate with the
drill, pitch the yeast, wait around for a bit while it absorbs some moisture
and then swirl the carboy by hand to get it to fall into the beer. Using
the drill briefly after pitching is such a good idea, I'm embarassed it
never occured to me. Thanks!
John.
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Date: 11 Aug 2006 00:13:29
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
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On Thu, 10 Aug 2006 14:57:04 -0700, <dave-gnus@bfnet.com > wrote:
> 1. don't worry, just sprinkle the dry yeast on top of the foam
This is what I do, I don't think it causes any problems. Even if you
pitch dry yeast into wort without any foam, it will take a little bit
for the yeast to sink. Basically the dry yeast has to absorb some of
the wort before it gets heavy enough to sink into the beer regardless of
whether there is foam on top. I don't think the presence of foam really
has much effect.
John.
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Date: 10 Aug 2006 15:18:57
From: David Wuertele
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
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Dan > I do #1 and aerate after as well.
If you're going to aerate after pitching the yeast anyway, why bother
aerating before pitching the yeast?
Dan > I use a primary bucket, so once the lid is on tight I rock it
Dan > back and forth on my lap and shake it up good.
Not really an option for me --- if I put my 14 gallon conical on my
lap, I would not only be unable to shake it, but I would risk serious
damage to the plumbing. The plumbing that counts. My plumbing. :-)
Dave
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Date: 11 Aug 2006 00:17:37
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
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On Thu, 10 Aug 2006 15:18:57 -0700, <dave-gnus@bfnet.com > wrote:
> Dan> I do #1 and aerate after as well.
>
> If you're going to aerate after pitching the yeast anyway, why bother
> aerating before pitching the yeast?
I think he just means that he pitches half way through aeration.
John.
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Date: 11 Aug 2006 08:53:43
From: Dan Logcher
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
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John 'Shaggy' Kolesar wrote:
> On Thu, 10 Aug 2006 15:18:57 -0700, <dave-gnus@bfnet.com> wrote:
>
>>Dan> I do #1 and aerate after as well.
>>
>>If you're going to aerate after pitching the yeast anyway, why bother
>>aerating before pitching the yeast?
>
>
> I think he just means that he pitches half way through aeration.
Well, what I should have said is.. I top off with tap water and that
creates foam while it aerates. I pitch on the foam, and stir until all
the dry bits are mixed in. Then I rock the bucket on my lap for about
a minutes or two.
--
Dan
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Date: 10 Aug 2006 20:04:55
From: Dan Logcher
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
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David Wuertele wrote:
> Dan> I do #1 and aerate after as well.
>
> If you're going to aerate after pitching the yeast anyway, why bother
> aerating before pitching the yeast?
Cuz I stir in the yeast.. that way huge clumps don't get stuck on
the lid when I shake it up.
> Dan> I use a primary bucket, so once the lid is on tight I rock it
> Dan> back and forth on my lap and shake it up good.
>
> Not really an option for me --- if I put my 14 gallon conical on my
> lap, I would not only be unable to shake it, but I would risk serious
> damage to the plumbing. The plumbing that counts. My plumbing. :-)
Not there yet.
--
Dan
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Date: 10 Aug 2006 15:08:23
From: Ryan Case
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
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David Wuertele wrote:
> After transfering my wort from the kettle to the primary, it is at
> 68F, and I stick in a sanitized paint mixer chucked into an electric
> drill and squeeze the trigger for about three minutes. This aerates
> the bejezus out of the wort, and results in a pretty deep foam sitting
> on top of the wort. Normally I pitch a vial of liquid yeast (no
> starter) into this, and I have no problems. The liquid goes right
> through the foam into the wort.
>
> Now I would like to try some dry yeast. But if I sprinkle the dry
> yeast on top of my aerated wort, it will probably just sit on top of
> the foam and not make it to the wort until the foam subsides. I have
> no idea what effect this might have. Which of these options would be
> the best way to proceed:
>
> 1. don't worry, just sprinkle the dry yeast on top of the foam
>
> 2. sprinkle the yeast on the wort *before* aerating
>
> 3. use a different method of aeration that doesn't create foam on top
> of the wort
>
> 4. reconstitute the yeast in liquid before pitching
>
> 5. (fill in the blank) ____________________________
>
>
> My intuition says that #2 will be fine, and is my best option.
>
> Dave
5.) Put the yeast in the bottom of the fermenter before the wort. I have
had really good results with that. So instead of pitching the yeast you
are almost pitching the wort. ;)
Seriously. I do this with all my yeasts, dry or liquid. I put them in
the bottom of the 12 gallon fermenter in the freezer. Pump out of my
system into a 7 gallon bottling bucket, set the bucket on the edge of
the freezer and pitch the wort on top of the yeast through the spigot in
the side of the bucket. I never fail to get foam up to and above the rim
of the fermenter.
Ryan
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Date: 10 Aug 2006 16:57:17
From: David Wuertele
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
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Ryan > 5.) Put the yeast in the bottom of the fermenter before the
Ryan > wort. I have had really good results with that. So instead of
Ryan > pitching the yeast you are almost pitching the wort. ;)
This is an interesting idea. My only worry is this: I transfer from
the kettle to the fermentor via a cross-flow chiller, and sometimes it
takes me a couple of quarts of transfer before I get the output
temperature pegged at the target pitching temperature. What effect
would it have to pour 90F or 50F wort on top of dry yeast?
Admittedly, it would be pretty easy to make sure my error is on the
side of too-cold wort by just cranking the chiller water volume way
up.
Dave
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Date: 11 Aug 2006 00:20:59
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
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On Thu, 10 Aug 2006 16:57:17 -0700, <dave-gnus@bfnet.com > wrote:
> Ryan> 5.) Put the yeast in the bottom of the fermenter before the
> Ryan> wort. I have had really good results with that. So instead of
> Ryan> pitching the yeast you are almost pitching the wort. ;)
>
> This is an interesting idea. My only worry is this: I transfer from
> the kettle to the fermentor via a cross-flow chiller, and sometimes it
> takes me a couple of quarts of transfer before I get the output
> temperature pegged at the target pitching temperature. What effect
> would it have to pour 90F or 50F wort on top of dry yeast?
Above 100F will be bad for the yeast, but I don't think it will kill them
instantly. Just a guess, but I don't think you'd have any problems.
John.
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Date: 10 Aug 2006 17:13:57
From: Ryan Case
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
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David Wuertele wrote:
> Ryan> 5.) Put the yeast in the bottom of the fermenter before the
> Ryan> wort. I have had really good results with that. So instead of
> Ryan> pitching the yeast you are almost pitching the wort. ;)
>
> This is an interesting idea. My only worry is this: I transfer from
> the kettle to the fermentor via a cross-flow chiller, and sometimes it
> takes me a couple of quarts of transfer before I get the output
> temperature pegged at the target pitching temperature. What effect
> would it have to pour 90F or 50F wort on top of dry yeast?
>
> Admittedly, it would be pretty easy to make sure my error is on the
> side of too-cold wort by just cranking the chiller water volume way
> up.
>
> Dave
I transfer the wort over at about 80F because the package says to
rehydrate at 90F I believe.
I then rely on the fermenting freezer to bring the temp down.
Ryan
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Date: 10 Aug 2006 18:03:13
From: Dan Logcher
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
|
David Wuertele wrote:
> After transfering my wort from the kettle to the primary, it is at
> 68F, and I stick in a sanitized paint mixer chucked into an electric
> drill and squeeze the trigger for about three minutes. This aerates
> the bejezus out of the wort, and results in a pretty deep foam sitting
> on top of the wort. Normally I pitch a vial of liquid yeast (no
> starter) into this, and I have no problems. The liquid goes right
> through the foam into the wort.
>
> Now I would like to try some dry yeast. But if I sprinkle the dry
> yeast on top of my aerated wort, it will probably just sit on top of
> the foam and not make it to the wort until the foam subsides. I have
> no idea what effect this might have. Which of these options would be
> the best way to proceed:
>
> 1. don't worry, just sprinkle the dry yeast on top of the foam
>
> 2. sprinkle the yeast on the wort *before* aerating
>
> 3. use a different method of aeration that doesn't create foam on top
> of the wort
>
> 4. reconstitute the yeast in liquid before pitching
>
> 5. (fill in the blank) ____________________________
>
>
> My intuition says that #2 will be fine, and is my best option.
I do #1 and aerate after as well. I use a primary bucket, so once
the lid is on tight I rock it back and forth on my lap and shake it
up good. So its shouldn't matter. My next batch I'm going to make
a starter from the dried yeast. That ought to help speed things
up a bit.
--
Dan
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Date: 11 Aug 2006 00:16:48
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
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On Thu, 10 Aug 2006 18:03:13 -0400, <dlogcher*xspam*@comcast.net > wrote:
> I do #1 and aerate after as well. I use a primary bucket, so once
> the lid is on tight I rock it back and forth on my lap and shake it
> up good. So its shouldn't matter. My next batch I'm going to make
> a starter from the dried yeast. That ought to help speed things
> up a bit.
Are you talking about just rehydrating, or do you really mean make
a starter? There should be no reason to make a starter with dry yeast.
You can if you really want to, but IMO it's just a waste of effort. A
typical 10gm packet already contains plenty of cells. Keep in mind that
a dry packet contains 2X - 4X the amount of yeast as a liquid tube/pack.
John.
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Date: 11 Aug 2006 08:48:45
From: Dan Logcher
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
|
John 'Shaggy' Kolesar wrote:
> On Thu, 10 Aug 2006 18:03:13 -0400, <dlogcher*xspam*@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>>I do #1 and aerate after as well. I use a primary bucket, so once
>>the lid is on tight I rock it back and forth on my lap and shake it
>>up good. So its shouldn't matter. My next batch I'm going to make
>>a starter from the dried yeast. That ought to help speed things
>>up a bit.
>
>
> Are you talking about just rehydrating, or do you really mean make
> a starter? There should be no reason to make a starter with dry yeast.
> You can if you really want to, but IMO it's just a waste of effort. A
> typical 10gm packet already contains plenty of cells. Keep in mind that
> a dry packet contains 2X - 4X the amount of yeast as a liquid tube/pack.
Yeahm I was going to make a starter. I noticed a long lag time from pitching
and thought I might reduce that with a starter, no? I have a packet of Safale
US-56 that says 11.5g. But still.. I usually pitch around 7-8pm and don't see
heavy airlock activity until the next day.. 24 hours.
--
Dan
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Date: 11 Aug 2006 15:05:35
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
|
On Fri, 11 Aug 2006 08:48:45 -0400, <dlogcher*xspam*@comcast.net > wrote:
> John 'Shaggy' Kolesar wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 10 Aug 2006 18:03:13 -0400, <dlogcher*xspam*@comcast.net> wrote:
>>
>>>I do #1 and aerate after as well. I use a primary bucket, so once
>>>the lid is on tight I rock it back and forth on my lap and shake it
>>>up good. So its shouldn't matter. My next batch I'm going to make
>>>a starter from the dried yeast. That ought to help speed things
>>>up a bit.
>>
>>
>> Are you talking about just rehydrating, or do you really mean make
>> a starter? There should be no reason to make a starter with dry yeast.
>> You can if you really want to, but IMO it's just a waste of effort. A
>> typical 10gm packet already contains plenty of cells. Keep in mind that
>> a dry packet contains 2X - 4X the amount of yeast as a liquid tube/pack.
>
> Yeahm I was going to make a starter. I noticed a long lag time from pitching
> and thought I might reduce that with a starter, no? I have a packet of Safale
> US-56 that says 11.5g. But still.. I usually pitch around 7-8pm and don't see
> heavy airlock activity until the next day.. 24 hours.
Try it and see if it helps. Unless your packets were abused during shipping
or storage, I think the cell count should be sufficient for a short lag
time. How do you aerate, that's a big factor in the lag time as well. If
there isn't enough oxygen to support healthy growth, then the yeast can
be slow to start. I know you said you aerate before and after pitching,
but I don't remember if you mentioned what aeration method you use?
John.
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Date: 12 Aug 2006 19:16:20
From: Dan Logcher
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
|
John 'Shaggy' Kolesar wrote:
> On Fri, 11 Aug 2006 08:48:45 -0400, <dlogcher*xspam*@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>>John 'Shaggy' Kolesar wrote:
>>
>>
>>>On Thu, 10 Aug 2006 18:03:13 -0400, <dlogcher*xspam*@comcast.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>I do #1 and aerate after as well. I use a primary bucket, so once
>>>>the lid is on tight I rock it back and forth on my lap and shake it
>>>>up good. So its shouldn't matter. My next batch I'm going to make
>>>>a starter from the dried yeast. That ought to help speed things
>>>>up a bit.
>>>
>>>
>>>Are you talking about just rehydrating, or do you really mean make
>>>a starter? There should be no reason to make a starter with dry yeast.
>>>You can if you really want to, but IMO it's just a waste of effort. A
>>>typical 10gm packet already contains plenty of cells. Keep in mind that
>>>a dry packet contains 2X - 4X the amount of yeast as a liquid tube/pack.
>>
>>Yeahm I was going to make a starter. I noticed a long lag time from pitching
>>and thought I might reduce that with a starter, no? I have a packet of Safale
>>US-56 that says 11.5g. But still.. I usually pitch around 7-8pm and don't see
>>heavy airlock activity until the next day.. 24 hours.
>
>
> Try it and see if it helps. Unless your packets were abused during shipping
> or storage, I think the cell count should be sufficient for a short lag
> time. How do you aerate, that's a big factor in the lag time as well. If
> there isn't enough oxygen to support healthy growth, then the yeast can
> be slow to start. I know you said you aerate before and after pitching,
> but I don't remember if you mentioned what aeration method you use?
I top off the fermentor with tap water and the faucet creates a long of
foam.. I assume that adds air to it. I usually stir a bit before adding
the yeast, pour the yeast on the foam and stir till it all gets wet.
Then I close the lid and shake vigorously.
--
Dan
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Date: 13 Aug 2006 02:36:17
From: John 'Shaggy' Kolesar
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
|
On Sat, 12 Aug 2006 19:16:20 -0400, <dlogcher*xspam*@comcast.net > wrote:
> I top off the fermentor with tap water and the faucet creates a long of
> foam.. I assume that adds air to it.
Probably not much.
> I usually stir a bit before adding
> the yeast, pour the yeast on the foam and stir till it all gets wet.
> Then I close the lid and shake vigorously.
Shaking like that will work, but you have to do it for a long time. Also,
with the lid closed, you're limited as to how much oxygen is available
to disolve into the beer. IMO, you're probably not getting much actual
aeration. That could be a factor in your long lag time. Personally,
I really like the Mix-stir aerator. It's relatively inexpensive, and
does a great job.
I think working on your aeration will probably give you better results than
making a starter for the dry yeast.
John.
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Date: 11 Aug 2006 17:27:45
From: Scott Sellers
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
|
Dan Logcher <dlogcher*xspam*@comcast.net >:
>John 'Shaggy' Kolesar wrote:
>> On Thu, 10 Aug 2006 18:03:13 -0400, <dlogcher*xspam*@comcast.net> wrote:
>>
>>>I do #1 and aerate after as well. I use a primary bucket, so
>>>once the lid is on tight I rock it back and forth on my lap
>>>and shake it up good. So its shouldn't matter. My next batch
>>>I'm going to make a starter from the dried yeast. That ought
>>>to help speed things up a bit.
>>
>>
>> Are you talking about just rehydrating, or do you really mean
>> make a starter? There should be no reason to make a starter
>> with dry yeast. You can if you really want to, but IMO it's
>> just a waste of effort. A typical 10gm packet already
>> contains plenty of cells. Keep in mind that a dry packet
>> contains 2X - 4X the amount of yeast as a liquid tube/pack.
>Yeahm I was going to make a starter. I noticed a long lag time
>from pitching and thought I might reduce that with a starter,
>no? I have a packet of Safale US-56 that says 11.5g. But
>still.. I usually pitch around 7-8pm and don't see heavy airlock
>activity until the next day.. 24 hours.
In addition to what JSK said about other factors (aeration,
possible damaged yeast), I'd probably pitch 2 packets of dry
before going to the effort of making a starter. IMO, starters
are only worthwhile when using liquid yeast.
Scott S
--
Scott Sellers
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Date: 11 Aug 2006 18:57:27
From: rjwhite6
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
|
On Fri, 11 Aug 2006 17:27:45 GMT, Scott Sellers
<scottsellers@mindspring.com > wrote:
>In addition to what JSK said about other factors (aeration,
>possible damaged yeast), I'd probably pitch 2 packets of dry
>before going to the effort of making a starter. IMO, starters
>are only worthwhile when using liquid yeast.
>
>Scott S
I usually pitch 2-3 packets of dry yeast when I use it.
On 5 gallon batches it takes off in just a couple of hours.
(for ales at 66-68 degrees)
One thing to keep in mind with the dry yeast: Some people have said
that what we think is a fast fermentation start with dry yeast is not
the start of fermentation but is foaming from the yeast rehydrating.
I prefer to naively believe that it really is a fast start to
fermentation :-)
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Date: 11 Aug 2006 10:23:23
From: Denny Conn
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
|
Dan Logcher wrote:
>But still.. I usually pitch around 7-8pm and don't see
> heavy airlock activity until the next day.. 24 hours.
That's really not a problem....
----------- >Denny
--
Life begins at 60...1.060, that is.
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Date: 11 Aug 2006 10:20:12
From: Denny Conn
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
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David Wuertele wrote:
> OK. Do you think it hurts the yeast if I beat it with a paint stirrer
> at 1000 RPM?
That has never been a problem for me.
---------- >Denny
--
Life begins at 60...1.060, that is.
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Date: 11 Aug 2006 10:17:21
From: Denny Conn
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
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David Wuertele wrote:
> My intuition says that #2 will be fine, and is my best option.
You are correct...#2 is the easiest way, and there's no reason not to do
it that way.
----------- >Denny
--
Life begins at 60...1.060, that is.
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Date: 11 Aug 2006 09:03:10
From: alebrewer
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
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The Artist Formerly Known as Kap'n Salty wrote:
> alebrewer wrote:
> >
> > If you cool your wort below 80 F before you pitch, you probably should
> > make a starter in 90-100 F water (as most manufacturer's recommend, but
> > I rarely ever do). Water (or wort) below 80F is not good for the dried
> > yeasties. When I sprinkle dired yeast on fully cooled wort (70F or
> > so), I have noticed this will delay obvious fermentation for 12 to 20
> > hours. But, if the wort is above 80, if I pitch prior to going to bed,
> > I have activity in the morning. Good enough for me.
> >
>
> You're not making a "starter" here -- technically it's rehydrating. A
> starter involves using wort to grow up the culture. No growth takes
> place during rehydrating.
You're right. My bad. I meant "re-hydrate" instead of "make a
starter". Just not paying attention to my fingers, I guess.
> Rehydration temps vary quite a bit by yeast strain, with a number of
> strains having optimal temps at or below 80. US-56 is ideally rehydrated
> around 80F. I think W34/70 is ideally rehydrated at around 70-75F.
> Apparently, the strains are rather picky about the temp used as well --
> meaning 90-100F may be a bad idea for some strains.
>
> All this is to say if you choose to rehydrate then you should check the
> mfgrs data sheet for the yeast -- don't just go the 90-100F route
> automatically.
Absolutely. Always check what the manufacturer recommends. I could
also add that if you aren't satisfied with the performance, re-check
the manufacturer's recommendations. It's a sure bet that their
information is better than what you would get off a newsgroup, anyway.
ab
> --
> (Replies: cleanse my address of the Mark of the Beast!)
>
> Teleoperate a roving mobile robot from the web:
> http://www.swampgas.com/robotics/rover.html
>
> Coauthor with Dennis Clark of "Building Robot Drive Trains".
> Buy several copies today!
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Date: 11 Aug 2006 06:50:12
From: alebrewer
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
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Dan Logcher wrote:
> David Wuertele wrote:
> > After transfering my wort from the kettle to the primary, it is at
> > 68F, and I stick in a sanitized paint mixer chucked into an electric
> > drill and squeeze the trigger for about three minutes. This aerates
> > the bejezus out of the wort, and results in a pretty deep foam sitting
> > on top of the wort. Normally I pitch a vial of liquid yeast (no
> > starter) into this, and I have no problems. The liquid goes right
> > through the foam into the wort.
> >
> > Now I would like to try some dry yeast. But if I sprinkle the dry
> > yeast on top of my aerated wort, it will probably just sit on top of
> > the foam and not make it to the wort until the foam subsides. I have
> > no idea what effect this might have. Which of these options would be
> > the best way to proceed:
> >
> > 1. don't worry, just sprinkle the dry yeast on top of the foam
> >
> > 2. sprinkle the yeast on the wort *before* aerating
> >
> > 3. use a different method of aeration that doesn't create foam on top
> > of the wort
> >
> > 4. reconstitute the yeast in liquid before pitching
> >
> > 5. (fill in the blank) ____________________________
> >
> >
> > My intuition says that #2 will be fine, and is my best option.
>
> I do #1 and aerate after as well. I use a primary bucket, so once
> the lid is on tight I rock it back and forth on my lap and shake it
> up good. So its shouldn't matter. My next batch I'm going to make
> a starter from the dried yeast. That ought to help speed things
> up a bit.
>
> --
> Dan
5. Don't bother aerating and spinkle the yeast on the wort while it is
between 80 and 90 deg F.
Really, why aerate with dried yeast? The dried yeast has plenty of
oxygen reserves (taken up prior to drying). They don't need it.
Same thing for makng a starter. With dried yeast, you aren't going to
help anything, just use up some of those oxygen reserves early. While
you aren't likely to seriously hurt the process, you aren't doing it
any good.
If you cool your wort below 80 F before you pitch, you probably should
make a starter in 90-100 F water (as most manufacturer's recommend, but
I rarely ever do). Water (or wort) below 80F is not good for the dried
yeasties. When I sprinkle dired yeast on fully cooled wort (70F or
so), I have noticed this will delay obvious fermentation for 12 to 20
hours. But, if the wort is above 80, if I pitch prior to going to bed,
I have activity in the morning. Good enough for me.
ab
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Date: 11 Aug 2006 09:05:48
From: The Artist Formerly Known as Kap'n Salty
Subject: Re: Aerating wort before pitch makes foam. Pitch dry yeast on top?
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alebrewer wrote:
>
> If you cool your wort below 80 F before you pitch, you probably should
> make a starter in 90-100 F water (as most manufacturer's recommend, but
> I rarely ever do). Water (or wort) below 80F is not good for the dried
> yeasties. When I sprinkle dired yeast on fully cooled wort (70F or
> so), I have noticed this will delay obvious fermentation for 12 to 20
> hours. But, if the wort is above 80, if I pitch prior to going to bed,
> I have activity in the morning. Good enough for me.
>
You're not making a "starter" here -- technically it's rehydrating. A
starter involves using wort to grow up the culture. No growth takes
place during rehydrating.
Rehydration temps vary quite a bit by yeast strain, with a number of
strains having optimal temps at or below 80. US-56 is ideally rehydrated
around 80F. I think W34/70 is ideally rehydrated at around 70-75F.
Apparently, the strains are rather picky about the temp used as well --
meaning 90-100F may be a bad idea for some strains.
All this is to say if you choose to rehydrate then you should check the
mfgrs data sheet for the yeast -- don't just go the 90-100F route
automatically.
--
(Replies: cleanse my address of the Mark of the Beast!)
Teleoperate a roving mobile robot from the web:
http://www.swampgas.com/robotics/rover.html
Coauthor with Dennis Clark of "Building Robot Drive Trains".
Buy several copies today!
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