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Date: 11 Sep 2007 15:32:44
From: shoemakerted@yahoo.com
Subject: apple juice vs cider vs hard cider vs vinegar
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Hello,
I would like to make some non-alcoholic cider, and I'd like to know
how to do it. In particular, how do I avoid turning soft cider into
either hard cider or vinegar?
And if it's hard cider, is there a concern about bad alcohol, as there
is with some other homemade liquors?
Thank you!
Ted Shoemaker
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Date: 12 Sep 2007 19:03:15
From: DragonTail
Subject: Re: apple juice vs cider vs hard cider vs vinegar
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shoemakerted@yahoo.com wrote:
> Hello,
>
> I would like to make some non-alcoholic cider, and I'd like to know
> how to do it. In particular, how do I avoid turning soft cider into
> either hard cider or vinegar?
snip
Press some apples to get the "non-alcoholic cider".
Basically, as some of the other follow up posts have said, at least in
my opinion, juice is filtered, cider is unfiltered, an vinegar is made
from hard (alcoholic) cider. Some places juice is "soft" or
non-alcoholic and cider is "hard or alcoholic. I've made cider vinegar,
actually have a batch going right now. It was pretty simple. I took
1/2 gal of fresh cider from a local orchard and made hard cider with dry
champagne yeast. When the fermentation was complete I racked to another
gallon jug, added a white wine "mother of vinegar", and let it go for
another month or so, with some cheesecloth over the mouth of the jug so
the "bacteria" could get air. Bottled in flip top bottles and saved the
new "mother", about a pint of the liquid and the "jellyfish" colony of
bacteria, for the next batch. The bottles went into a water bath to
boil and "stop" the bacteria.
As for avoiding turning "soft" into "hard" or vinegar, keep it in the
fridge and drink it up in a week or two. If you want to keep it longer
freeze it.
Hope that helps.
Cheers,
--
Michael Herrenbruck
Herrenbruck Brewery
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Date: 12 Sep 2007 10:10:04
From: shoemakerted@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: apple juice vs cider vs hard cider vs vinegar
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On Sep 11, 11:25 pm, "Bob F" <bobnos...@gmail.com > wrote:
>
> > make some non-alcoholic cider
>
> Squash apples.
Yes. That makes apple *juice*. Which, according to plenty of
internet writers, is the same as non-alcoholic cider. But 20 years
and 1500 miles ago, I saw apple juice for sale right next to apple
cider; the two tasted different. People talked about turning juice
into soft cider, then soft cider into either hard cider or vinegar.
So I'll ask again, hoping that someone can point me to a soft cider
recipe.
Thanks for the responses.
Ted Shoemaker
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Date: 13 Sep 2007 00:16:07
From: TARogue
Subject: Re: apple juice vs cider vs hard cider vs vinegar
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On Wed, 12 Sep 2007 10:10:04 -0700, "shoemakerted@yahoo.com" wrote:
>On Sep 11, 11:25 pm, "Bob F" <bobnos...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > make some non-alcoholic cider
>>
>> Squash apples.
>
> Yes. That makes apple *juice*. Which, according to plenty of
> internet writers, is the same as non-alcoholic cider.
>
Apple *juice* i much clearer than cider. Juice looks filtered, cider
appears unfiltered.
According to http://www.answerbag.com/q_view/36322
. Commercial apple juices are run through several filters to remove any
. particulate matter. This also changes the colour of the product from
. brown to yellow. The resulting product may have potassium sorbate or a
. related product added to inhibit fermentation. Commercial juices are
. usually pasteurized, although it is not required if the juice is kept
. refrigerated. The filtering process affects the flavour of the juice,
. which is why some people prefer traditional apple cider; pasteurization
. also affects the flavour.
.
. Plain or traditional cider - sometimes called soft cider - may go
. through a coarse filtering process to remove large particles. This is
. optional, depending on the product the producer is trying to obtain. The
. juice is then bottled with potassium sorbate to inhibit fermentation and
. refrigerated. It is not pasteurized and does not need to be if keep
. refeigerated. It does, however, have a shorter storage life than
. commercial pasteurized juices.
.
So, there you go.
Tom
--
TARogue (t o m (at) t a r o g u e . n e t)
I've found the loophole in democracy.
It's stupid people.
Vast masses of stupid people.
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Date: 12 Sep 2007 12:35:31
From: Bob F
Subject: Re: apple juice vs cider vs hard cider vs vinegar
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<shoemakerted@yahoo.com > wrote in message
news:1189617004.432453.155430@d55g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
> On Sep 11, 11:25 pm, "Bob F" <bobnos...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > make some non-alcoholic cider
>>
>> Squash apples.
>
> Yes. That makes apple *juice*. Which, according to plenty of
> internet writers, is the same as non-alcoholic cider. But 20 years
> and 1500 miles ago, I saw apple juice for sale right next to apple
> cider; the two tasted different. People talked about turning juice
> into soft cider, then soft cider into either hard cider or vinegar.
>
> So I'll ask again, hoping that someone can point me to a soft cider
> recipe.
As others have said, here in the US, cider is unfiltered, juice is filtered.
If you want a real treat, press some apples and put the resulting "cider" into 2
liter soda bottles. Put them into the back of the fridge. Wait a few months
until the bottles are hard from carbonization. Drink before they explode. The
result is a very "appley" sweet bubbly drink with low alcohol. I always do a few
of these when I press apples. Maybe this is "soft cider"?
Bob
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Date: 12 Sep 2007 13:52:46
From: Paul Arthur
Subject: Re: apple juice vs cider vs hard cider vs vinegar
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On 2007-09-12, shoemakerted@yahoo.com <shoemakerted@yahoo.com > wrote:
> On Sep 11, 11:25 pm, "Bob F" <bobnos...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > make some non-alcoholic cider
>>
>> Squash apples.
>
> Yes. That makes apple *juice*. Which, according to plenty of
> internet writers, is the same as non-alcoholic cider. But 20 years
> and 1500 miles ago, I saw apple juice for sale right next to apple
> cider; the two tasted different. People talked about turning juice
> into soft cider, then soft cider into either hard cider or vinegar.
Wrong way 'round. Cider is generally unfiltered apple juice, and juice
is filtered apple juice. And they do taste different. To make apple
cider, squash apples. Drink.
Unless by "soft cider" they meant "less-hard cider", which I suppose is
possible.
> So I'll ask again, hoping that someone can point me to a soft cider
> recipe.
Apples + pressure = cider. You can do fancy things to it after that
like adding spices and whatnot, but you'd have to be more specific as to
what you're looking for.
Or, of course, you can ferment it, but then it's not "soft apple cider".
--
You know you're using the computer too much when:
u realise that windows is not all it sounds
--DEaigo
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Date: 12 Sep 2007 17:41:24
From: Joel
Subject: Re: apple juice vs cider vs hard cider vs vinegar
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shoemakerted@yahoo.com <shoemakerted@yahoo.com > wrote:
>On Sep 11, 11:25 pm, "Bob F" <bobnos...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > make some non-alcoholic cider
>>
>> Squash apples.
>
>Yes. That makes apple *juice*. Which, according to plenty of
>internet writers, is the same as non-alcoholic cider. But 20 years
>and 1500 miles ago, I saw apple juice for sale right next to apple
>cider; the two tasted different. People talked about turning juice
>into soft cider, then soft cider into either hard cider or vinegar.
Any definition I've seen in the US (I grew up in apple-growing
country, and live now in another area apples are grown) calls
"cider" the unfiltered (or coarsely filtered) liquid from pressed
apples. They define "juice" as filtered, possibly concentrated and
reconstituted, possibly otherwise stabilized and/or sweetened,
liquid pressed from apples. In other words, cider comes first,
then gets made into juice, as I've seen it.
To me, apple *cider* also has a fresher, rougher, tarter (though
that often depends as much on apple variety than anything else)
than sweeter, cleaner, bleh-er apple *juice.* Both taste like
apples.
>So I'll ask again, hoping that someone can point me to a soft cider
>recipe.
To me, "soft" means completely non-alcoholic, as in "soft drink."
I don't know of any different answer than the one I and other
have provided given that definition. And I know people who make
"hard cider" who use cider from the local orchard-- which is a
pressed blend of locally grown apples, coarsely filtered, then
pasteurized to make it legal to sell. I imagine cider vinegar would
be make the same way, except using acetic bacteria rather than yeast.
--
Joel Plutchak "They're not people, they're HIPPIES!"
$LASTNAME at VERYWARMmail.com - Eric Cartman
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Date: 12 Sep 2007 17:49:51
From: Joel
Subject: Re: apple juice vs cider vs hard cider vs vinegar
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Joel <plutchak AT see.headers > wrote:
> To me, apple *cider* also has a fresher, rougher, tarter (though
>that often depends as much on apple variety than anything else)
>than sweeter, cleaner, bleh-er apple *juice.*
Not to beat on this particular horse too much, but this
article confirms my experiences to the letter:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_cider
--
Joel Plutchak "They're not people, they're HIPPIES!"
$LASTNAME at VERYWARMmail.com - Eric Cartman
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Date: 12 Sep 2007 17:38:23
From: Faux_Pseudo
Subject: Re: apple juice vs cider vs hard cider vs vinegar
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_.-In rec.crafts.brewing, shoemakerted@yahoo.com wrote the following -._
>> > make some non-alcoholic cider
>>
>> Squash apples.
>
> Yes. That makes apple *juice*. Which, according to plenty of
> internet writers, is the same as non-alcoholic cider. But 20 years
> and 1500 miles ago, I saw apple juice for sale right next to apple
> cider; the two tasted different. People talked about turning juice
> into soft cider, then soft cider into either hard cider or vinegar.
Add some spices to it.
--
=()==()==()==()==()- http://fauxascii.com
\ \ \ \ \ \ ASCII artist
:F_P:-O- -O- -O- -O- -O- -O- -O- Get your ASCII Art T-Shirt:
http://www.keystroketshirts.com/ascii/dream-in-ascii-fullView.php
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Date: 12 Sep 2007 17:32:57
From: Scott Sellers
Subject: Re: apple juice vs cider vs hard cider vs vinegar
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shoemakerted@yahoo.com <shoemakerted@yahoo.com >:
>On Sep 11, 11:25 pm, "Bob F" <bobnos...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > make some non-alcoholic cider
>>
>> Squash apples.
>Yes. That makes apple *juice*. Which, according to plenty of
>internet writers, is the same as non-alcoholic cider. But 20
>years and 1500 miles ago, I saw apple juice for sale right next
>to apple cider; the two tasted different. People talked about
>turning juice into soft cider, then soft cider into either hard
>cider or vinegar.
You can still find apple juice labeled 'cider'. We always called
it "apple cider", not apple juice, when I was a kid. It was not
alcholic.
>So I'll ask again, hoping that someone can point me to a soft
>cider recipe.
I doubt you'll find a recipe. You might find a definition.
My guess, the distinction you're making, between non-alcoholic
juices, might have to do with spicing of the juice labeled cider,
perhaps some aging.
Historically, I'd guess the spectrum from juice to soft cider to
hard cider had all to do with alcohol content.
cheers,
Scott S
--
Scott Sellers
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Date: 11 Sep 2007 21:25:21
From: Bob F
Subject: Re: apple juice vs cider vs hard cider vs vinegar
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<shoemakerted@yahoo.com > wrote in message
news:1189549964.707202.67320@19g2000hsx.googlegroups.com...
> Hello,
>
> I would like to make some non-alcoholic cider, and I'd like to know
> how to do it.
Squash apples.
> In particular, how do I avoid turning soft cider into
> either hard cider or vinegar?
Freeze it until you want to drink it.
>
> And if it's hard cider, is there a concern about bad alcohol, as there
> is with some other homemade liquors?
No such problem exists as far as I know.
Bob
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Date: 11 Sep 2007 23:48:55
From: Joel
Subject: Re: apple juice vs cider vs hard cider vs vinegar
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shoemakerted@yahoo.com <shoemakerted@yahoo.com > wrote:
>I would like to make some non-alcoholic cider, and I'd like to know
>how to do it.
Crush/press the juice from apples. Voila! Cider!
>In particular, how do I avoid turning soft cider into
>either hard cider or vinegar?
Practice good sanitation with your utensils and containers,
and pasteurize (or maybe treat with sorbate) the juice. That'll
inhibit wild yeast and bacteria, so no alcohol or vinegar.
>And if it's hard cider, is there a concern about bad alcohol, as there
>is with some other homemade liquors?
If you're making non-alcoholic cider, there's no concern
with alcohol, right? But in general, only if you distill is
there a concern with concentrating "bad" alcohol.
--
Joel Plutchak "They're not people, they're HIPPIES!"
$LASTNAME at VERYWARMmail.com - Eric Cartman
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