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Main
Date: 16 Sep 2007 09:25:37
From: ant
Subject: Alcoholic fruit juice
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Someone here posted a story about some cherry juice going alcoholic, and
there was brief talk about fermenting fruit juice. I just wanted to clarify
this, as it's an interesting idea.
So, could you get a plastic bottle of, say, guava juice or something, put in
some sort of yeast, and end up with alcoholised juice? I must be missing
something, it must be harder than that?
--
ant
Don't try to reply to my email addy:
I'm borrowing that of the latest
scammer/spammer
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Date: 22 Sep 2007 05:31:35
From: Dick Adams
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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I purchased a bottle of Juicy-Juice Cherry and fermented
it with honey, Lalvin DV10, yeast nutrient and pectic
enzyme. A week later it was delicious. I going to do
it again using three quarts with 15 lbs of honey in a
five gallon batch.
Dick
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Date: 22 Sep 2007 22:31:35
From: ant
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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OK, I poked around the supermarket today, getting ideas. (pity orange juice
is out, they all seem to have mostly this).
Now, yeast comes in sachets. When I do my beer, it comes in a sachet. The
sachet does 23 litres of beer! I won't have 23 litres of juice (since you
can't do orange juice), it'll be quite a bit less.
So how do you throw in the right amount of yeast? It must be about a pinch,
for your average bottle of juice. And you can't sticky-tape up the sachet
for future use, after taking a pinch, can you?
And why can't we use baker's yeast for this stuff?! I make a lot of pizza
dough, so I have a container of yeast for that in the fridge. It'd sure make
things a lot easier.
--
ant
Don't try to reply to my email addy:
I'm borrowing that of the latest
scammer/spammer
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Date: 23 Sep 2007 19:45:24
From: Dick Adams
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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"ant" <claimsagent_directives@yahoo.co.uk > wrote:
> OK, I poked around the supermarket today, getting ideas.
> (pity orange juice is out, they all seem to have mostly this).
Good move!
> Now, yeast comes in sachets. When I do my beer, it comes in a
> sachet. The sachet does 23 litres of beer! I won't have 23
> litres of juice (since you can't do orange juice), it'll be
> quite a bit less.
>
> So how do you throw in the right amount of yeast? It must be
> about a pinch, for your average bottle of juice. And you can't
> sticky-tape up the sachet for future use, after taking a pinch,
> can you?
You can as long as you keep it refrigerated.
What I do is
- buy a 2 liter bottle of Juicy Juice or two cans of frozen
concentrate;
- heat a liter of water in a pot to about 158F (70C) and
dissolve two pounds into it;
- Add all of it to a 4 liter jug an fill with water leaving
adequate head room, and shake the hell out of it;
- add a teaspoon of pectic enzxme, put a bung and an
airlock on it, and let it sit for a day or two;
- it helps a lot if you pump qxygen into it for 60 seconds
- then add 1/2 tsp of yeast and 1/2 tsp of yeast nutrient;
- about three hours later, add 1/4 tsp of yeast nutrient;
- let it sit in a dark place for 10 days.
> And why can't we use baker's yeast for this stuff?! I make
> a lot of pizza dough, so I have a container of yeast for
> that in the fridge. It'd sure make things a lot easier.
If you use baker's yeast, you will probably get a fermented
juice that has an uncooked pizza dough taste to it.
Dick
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Date: 22 Sep 2007 16:49:59
From: Joel
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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ant <claimsagent_directives@yahoo.co.uk > wrote:
>OK, I poked around the supermarket today, getting ideas. (pity orange juice
>is out, they all seem to have mostly this).
>
>Now, yeast comes in sachets. When I do my beer, it comes in a sachet. The
>sachet does 23 litres of beer! I won't have 23 litres of juice (since you
>can't do orange juice), it'll be quite a bit less.
>So how do you throw in the right amount of yeast?
I don't think overpitching will be that big of a
deal. I'd just throw it all in. Assuming anywhere
in the vicinity of 5 gallons... even one or two
gallons (any lesser volume would be pointless IMO,
given losses to trub, sampling, etc.).
>And you can't sticky-tape up the sachet
>for future use, after taking a pinch, can you?
You can certainly do that. I'd still use more
than "a pinch" since a fast start and a nice healthy
fermentation is never a bad thing.
>And why can't we use baker's yeast for this stuff?! I make a lot of pizza
>dough, so I have a container of yeast for that in the fridge. It'd sure make
>things a lot easier.
Baker's yeast isn't developed for the same
characteristics as is beer (or wine) yeast. From a
very little bit of distant experience coupled with
reports from others, you'd get a very "yeasty"
flavor that isn't necessarily good.
--
Joel Plutchak "They're not people, they're HIPPIES!"
$LASTNAME at VERYWARMmail.com - Eric Cartman
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Date: 23 Sep 2007 12:26:01
From: ant
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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Joel wrote:
> I don't think overpitching will be that big of a
> deal. I'd just throw it all in. Assuming anywhere
> in the vicinity of 5 gallons... even one or two
> gallons (any lesser volume would be pointless IMO,
> given losses to trub, sampling, etc.).
The more interesting juices here come in 1.5 litre bottles, so I guess I'll
just get a few of those. nowhere near 23 litres though.
>> And you can't sticky-tape up the sachet
>> for future use, after taking a pinch, can you?
>
> You can certainly do that. I'd still use more
> than "a pinch" since a fast start and a nice healthy
> fermentation is never a bad thing.
ah, good. that's handy to know. Maybe see how the first lot goes, and then
do some subsequent batches to use up the sachet.
This'll be a fun chemistry experiment.
>> And why can't we use baker's yeast for this stuff?! I make a lot of
>> pizza dough, so I have a container of yeast for that in the fridge.
>> It'd sure make things a lot easier.
>
> Baker's yeast isn't developed for the same
> characteristics as is beer (or wine) yeast. From a
> very little bit of distant experience coupled with
> reports from others, you'd get a very "yeasty"
> flavor that isn't necessarily good.
Thanks for that. I figured there must be a good reason. it does have a
strong taste, you get it in home-made breads, and when making the pizza
dough it's really "there". Temperamental stuff, too.
--
ant
Don't try to reply to my email addy:
I'm borrowing that of the latest
scammer/spammer
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Date: 23 Sep 2007 10:43:13
From: Mark R
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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"ant" <claimsagent_directives@yahoo.co.uk > wrote in message
>>
>> Baker's yeast isn't developed for the same
>> characteristics as is beer (or wine) yeast. From a
>> very little bit of distant experience coupled with
>> reports from others, you'd get a very "yeasty"
>> flavor that isn't necessarily good.
>
> Thanks for that. I figured there must be a good reason. it does have a
> strong taste, you get it in home-made breads, and when making the pizza
> dough it's really "there". Temperamental stuff, too.
For that mater yeast for brewing imparts flavor into the brew. Another
experiment would be to do identical batches of brew except use two different
strains of yeast. You'll notice the difference.
Mark R
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Date: 17 Sep 2007 16:27:10
From: Paul Arthur
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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On 2007-09-15, ant <claimsagent_directives@yahoo.co.uk > wrote:
> Someone here posted a story about some cherry juice going alcoholic, and
> there was brief talk about fermenting fruit juice. I just wanted to clarify
> this, as it's an interesting idea.
>
> So, could you get a plastic bottle of, say, guava juice or something, put in
> some sort of yeast, and end up with alcoholised juice?
More commonly known as "wine."
It would be better to ferment it in a carboy with an airlock fitted.
> I must be missing something, it must be harder than that?
Not really.
--
Hah! All Woodworking, Photography, and Robotics Sucks, too.
Sysadmin isn't a job title, it's a mindset. You'll *never* quit.
--Maarten Wiltink in the Monastery
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Date: 18 Sep 2007 23:02:40
From: ant
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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Paul Arthur wrote:
> On 2007-09-15, ant <claimsagent_directives@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>> Someone here posted a story about some cherry juice going alcoholic,
>> and there was brief talk about fermenting fruit juice. I just wanted
>> to clarify this, as it's an interesting idea.
>>
>> So, could you get a plastic bottle of, say, guava juice or
>> something, put in some sort of yeast, and end up with alcoholised
>> juice?
>
> More commonly known as "wine."
>
> It would be better to ferment it in a carboy with an airlock fitted.
>
>> I must be missing something, it must be harder than that?
>
> Not really.
holy crap.
Well, I'll get a water vent thing and make a hole in the plastic lid of my
old port container (giant fat glass thing in a basket).
OK, big question, what kind of yeast to use, and how much? I've only made
the standard 23 litres of beer. What's the proportion of yeast to fruit
juice to use?
This might be fun.
--
ant
Don't try to reply to my email addy:
I'm borrowing that of the latest
scammer/spammer
|
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Date: 18 Sep 2007 19:23:12
From: Bob F
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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"ant" <claimsagent_directives@yahoo.co.uk > wrote in message
news:5la0itF6vrqiU1@mid.individual.net...
> Paul Arthur wrote:
>> On 2007-09-15, ant <claimsagent_directives@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>> Someone here posted a story about some cherry juice going alcoholic,
>>> and there was brief talk about fermenting fruit juice. I just wanted
>>> to clarify this, as it's an interesting idea.
>>>
>>> So, could you get a plastic bottle of, say, guava juice or
>>> something, put in some sort of yeast, and end up with alcoholised
>>> juice?
>>
>> More commonly known as "wine."
>>
>> It would be better to ferment it in a carboy with an airlock fitted.
>>
>>> I must be missing something, it must be harder than that?
>>
>> Not really.
>
> holy crap.
>
> Well, I'll get a water vent thing and make a hole in the plastic lid of my old
> port container (giant fat glass thing in a basket).
>
> OK, big question, what kind of yeast to use, and how much? I've only made the
> standard 23 litres of beer. What's the proportion of yeast to fruit juice to
> use?
>
For cider, I've used a couple kinds of dry wine yeast and multiple dry ale
yeasts. Same amount as you'd use in the equivalent amount of beer.
Also, for cider, I've put it in the fridge and left it with no added yeasts
after I pressed the apples. A few months later, it's bubbly, still sweet, and
delicious. At this point, the apple taste is obvious. Not like fully fermented
out cider.
Bob
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Date: 18 Sep 2007 16:24:52
From: DragonTail
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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>
> OK, big question, what kind of yeast to use, and how much? I've only made
> the standard 23 litres of beer. What's the proportion of yeast to fruit
> juice to use?
I've used ale yeast and cider yeast, both in liquid form, from White
Labs and had good results.
Just pitch as you would for any ale you may have made before.
Cheers,
--
Michael Herrenbruck
Herrenbruck Brewery
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Date: 16 Sep 2007 18:31:59
From: Washu
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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On Sep 16, 1:40 pm, Randall Nortman <usenet8...@wonderclown.com >
wrote:
> On 2007-09-16, Washu <rgran...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> [...]
>
> > I would use a glass gallon jug and an airlock myself, but whatever
> > makes you happy. You might
> > want to try some plastic wrap and a rubber band to cap the bottle with
> > though that way you'd
> > blow off the wrap before the bottle split open.
>
> You're saying that you just hold the plastic wrap on with the rubber
> band, no cap? Doesn't sound like it would hold much pressure at all,
> and therefore you wouldn't develop much carbonation. I guess if
> you're going for a still wine that would be fine, but fizzy is nice.
>
> --
> Randall
Right, I was thinking still. If you want fizzy just prime it when you
bottle
like any bottle conditioned beer.
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Date: 16 Sep 2007 03:27:07
From: Dick Adams
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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"ant" <claimsagent_directives@yahoo.co.uk > wrote:
> Someone here posted a story about some cherry juice
> going alcoholic, and there was brief talk about
> fermenting fruit juice. I just wanted to clarify this,
> as it's an interesting idea.
>
> So, could you get a plastic bottle of, say, guava juice
> or something, put in some sort of yeast, and end up with
> alcoholised juice? I must be missing something, it must
> be harder than that?
Go to the store and purchase concentrate or juice. But
read the label carefully to make `certain' that no
preservatives have been added. Read the following URL
winemaking.jackkeller.net/request181.asp
Jack Keller is a high priest of winemaking. He used
sugar. I used honey. A glass of this stuff before
going to bed appears to be a cure for my chronic
insomnia.
I also have done this with apple juice once with honey
and once with sugar. IMO honey makes a better brew.
I found my recipe for Chateau Trailer Park which
explains how to do it with Kool-Aid and will post it.
Dick
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Date: 16 Sep 2007 22:39:15
From: ant
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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Dick Adams wrote:
> "ant" <claimsagent_directives@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>> Someone here posted a story about some cherry juice
>> going alcoholic, and there was brief talk about
>> fermenting fruit juice. I just wanted to clarify this,
>> as it's an interesting idea.
>>
>> So, could you get a plastic bottle of, say, guava juice
>> or something, put in some sort of yeast, and end up with
>> alcoholised juice? I must be missing something, it must
>> be harder than that?
>
> Go to the store and purchase concentrate or juice. But
> read the label carefully to make `certain' that no
> preservatives have been added. Read the following URL
> winemaking.jackkeller.net/request181.asp
>
> Jack Keller is a high priest of winemaking. He used
> sugar. I used honey. A glass of this stuff before
> going to bed appears to be a cure for my chronic
> insomnia.
somthing many of us walk with.
I'll investigate that site. Winemaking sounds scary and difficult (beer is
straightforward), but I'm interested in it.
> I also have done this with apple juice once with honey
> and once with sugar. IMO honey makes a better brew.
> I found my recipe for Chateau Trailer Park which
> explains how to do it with Kool-Aid and will post it.
My mother farms 900 apple trees, I guess it's time i did the logical and
made the juice alcoholic (we sell the apples, which are tree-ripened (and
minimum sprayed, we use biological controls), at a very good price to all
the people who come to the farm to buy them). Some of our customers are
from the old yugoslavia, and love to trade stuff, to barter, rather than use
money. So we get amazing salamis, bread, hams, grape cuttings no one's ever
heard of, and "apple cider". This stuff could ignite nuclear bombs, it ain't
cider. Dunno if they distill it, or just brew it, but it's nostril-burning
stuff.
As for the kool-aid, we call it Cordial here, and I do not believe you could
alcoholise it! nice if you could though. I guess there's sugar there.
--
ant
Don't try to reply to my email addy:
I'm borrowing that of the latest
scammer/spammer
|
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Date: 17 Sep 2007 15:02:14
From: Derric
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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> ... Winemaking sounds scary and difficult (beer is straightforward) ...
Nah... it's easier than beer... no boiling necessary, etc. Find a
homebrew store and buy a kit and try it... You can use your beer
equipment and shouldn't have to buy anything else. You can even bottle
in beer bottles if you want (we also re-use screw-top wine bottles too,
or you can buy a corker for regular bottles).
> My mother farms 900 apple trees, I guess it's time i did the logical and
> made the juice alcoholic ...
> ... So we get ... and "apple cider". This stuff could ignite nuclear
> bombs, it ain't cider. Dunno if they distill it, or just brew it, but
> it's nostril-burning stuff.
They probably add sugar and/or honey to it to kick up the alcohol
content a good bit. You don't have to do that. It's also probably
"young."
If you just ferment the juice only, it is very good. It helps to let it
age a while. The first batch I made was best after about 1 or 2 years.
It had a little honey in it and tasted very much like a Chardonnay.
So.... start a couple batches up this year and another batch or two
every year to get your pipeline started!
You can make it sparkling like beer or still like wine - your choice,
it's good both ways. I bottle it in beer bottles.
Hmmm... I have a batch that is just now a year old... time to break a
bottle out and see!
Derric
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Date: 18 Sep 2007 23:06:02
From: ant
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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Derric wrote:
>> ... Winemaking sounds scary and difficult (beer is straightforward)
>> ...
>
> Nah... it's easier than beer... no boiling necessary, etc. Find a
> homebrew store and buy a kit and try it...
I'm pretty sure my homebrew store hasn't got anything for wine, or weird
stuff with fruit juice.
they have some kits for ginger beer and apple cider, but that's about it.
although wine makers do shop there, according to the owner.
You can use your beer
> equipment and shouldn't have to buy anything else. You can even
> bottle in beer bottles if you want (we also re-use screw-top wine
> bottles too, or you can buy a corker for regular bottles).
We're using Stelvin seals for more and more wine in Oz. but they're not
pressurised.... so you don't need pressure capability for this fermented
fruit juice?
> If you just ferment the juice only, it is very good. It helps to let
> it age a while. The first batch I made was best after about 1 or 2
> years. It had a little honey in it and tasted very much like a
> Chardonnay.
Did you have to "fine" it or do something fancy? I still can't believe it's
this simple.
> You can make it sparkling like beer or still like wine - your choice,
> it's good both ways. I bottle it in beer bottles.
>
> Hmmm... I have a batch that is just now a year old... time to break a
> bottle out and see!
Bloody hell.
Do you end up with a higher alcohol content, like wine?
--
ant
Don't try to reply to my email addy:
I'm borrowing that of the latest
scammer/spammer
|
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Date: 18 Sep 2007 16:49:48
From: Derric
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
|
> We're using Stelvin seals for more and more wine in Oz. but they're not
> pressurised.... so you don't need pressure capability for this fermented
> fruit juice?
No pressure necessary for "wine" ... which is normally "still." You
certainly *CAN* carbonate your fermented fruit juice if you want to ...
it would be "sparkling" then - like Champagne. You carbonate just like
you do beer and would need bottles that can handle the pressure.
> Did you have to "fine" it or do something fancy? I still can't believe it's
> this simple.
No need to "fine" it, especially if you allow it to sit for a long time.
You can just rack off the sediment several times until you have perfectly
clear wine. (For the cider I've made, it may take a year or more to
become perfectly clear by gravity settling.)
Making alcoholic apple cider is absolutely dead simple. Put juice in a
clean container, add yeast, wait, drink! ((If the juice isn't pasturized,
then I understand the natural yeast from the apples will make good cider
naturally, with some slight risk of bacterial spoilage - but I think
I'd still add some yeast.)) For yeast, I've used the normal dry ale
yeasts, Nottingham, Coopers, etc. Then just rack occasionally until
it is clear enough for you. Bottle. (OR... bottle earlier and let it
sit and clear in the bottles.) Add some sugar at bottling if you want
it carbonated/sparkling.
For my first batch, I added a quart or so of honey, diluted to a gallon,
in 4 gallons of juice. That produced a very Chardonnay tasting drink
in a year or two. Here are my notes:
http://geocities.com/derric1961/history/brew022.html
("SO" is the brand of juice/honey I used). Technically, honey in cider
makes a "cyser."
There are complications in wine-making regarding acid levels and other
stuff... for kits, that's already handled for you. For cider I don't
think it is a problem. All-in-all it is simpler than beer.
Jack Keller has all kinds of "fruit" wine recipes here:
http://winemaking.jackkeller.net/
At the bottom, he has "introduction to" and "getting started" pages and
recipes. I made one of his peach recipes and it is excellent - and is
still aging in a carboy at 1+ years old.
> Do you end up with a higher alcohol content, like wine?
In general, yes. I think that most "straight" apple juice will ferment
to something in the 8-10% range. If you want a more wine-like 14% or so,
you can add sugar/honey/etc. Ie., you control the alcohol level with
how much sugar you add. Adding sugar to fruit wines is "normal" ...
sometimes LOTS of sugar (in some recipes).
Derric
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Date: 19 Sep 2007 21:36:12
From: ant
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
|
Awesome, thanks for that.
And you can use pasteurised juice? I guess you add the yeast, and all you
need is sugar, that's in there.
This will be fun.
Derric wrote:
>> We're using Stelvin seals for more and more wine in Oz. but they're
>> not pressurised.... so you don't need pressure capability for this
>> fermented fruit juice?
>
> No pressure necessary for "wine" ... which is normally "still." You
> certainly *CAN* carbonate your fermented fruit juice if you want to
> ... it would be "sparkling" then - like Champagne. You carbonate
> just like you do beer and would need bottles that can handle the
> pressure.
>
>
>> Did you have to "fine" it or do something fancy? I still can't
>> believe it's this simple.
>
> No need to "fine" it, especially if you allow it to sit for a long
> time. You can just rack off the sediment several times until you have
> perfectly clear wine. (For the cider I've made, it may take a year
> or more to become perfectly clear by gravity settling.)
>
> Making alcoholic apple cider is absolutely dead simple. Put juice in
> a clean container, add yeast, wait, drink! ((If the juice isn't
> pasturized, then I understand the natural yeast from the apples will
> make good cider naturally, with some slight risk of bacterial
> spoilage - but I think
> I'd still add some yeast.)) For yeast, I've used the normal dry ale
> yeasts, Nottingham, Coopers, etc. Then just rack occasionally until
> it is clear enough for you. Bottle. (OR... bottle earlier and let it
> sit and clear in the bottles.) Add some sugar at bottling if you want
> it carbonated/sparkling.
>
> For my first batch, I added a quart or so of honey, diluted to a
> gallon, in 4 gallons of juice. That produced a very Chardonnay
> tasting drink
> in a year or two. Here are my notes:
> http://geocities.com/derric1961/history/brew022.html
> ("SO" is the brand of juice/honey I used). Technically, honey in
> cider makes a "cyser."
>
> There are complications in wine-making regarding acid levels and other
> stuff... for kits, that's already handled for you. For cider I don't
> think it is a problem. All-in-all it is simpler than beer.
>
> Jack Keller has all kinds of "fruit" wine recipes here:
> http://winemaking.jackkeller.net/
> At the bottom, he has "introduction to" and "getting started" pages
> and recipes. I made one of his peach recipes and it is excellent -
> and is still aging in a carboy at 1+ years old.
>
>
>> Do you end up with a higher alcohol content, like wine?
>
> In general, yes. I think that most "straight" apple juice will
> ferment to something in the 8-10% range. If you want a more
> wine-like 14% or so, you can add sugar/honey/etc. Ie., you control
> the alcohol level with
> how much sugar you add. Adding sugar to fruit wines is "normal" ...
> sometimes LOTS of sugar (in some recipes).
>
> Derric
--
ant
Don't try to reply to my email addy:
I'm borrowing that of the latest
scammer/spammer
|
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Date: 19 Sep 2007 13:35:53
From: Joel
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
|
ant <claimsagent_directives@yahoo.co.uk > wrote:
>Awesome, thanks for that.
>
>And you can use pasteurised juice? I guess you add the yeast, and all you
>need is sugar, that's in there.
Yes, pasteurized is probably safest. What you to want to avoid
is juice that has preservatives like potassium benzoate and
similar additives. They act as a bacteria-- and yeast-- inhibitor.
--
Joel Plutchak "They're not people, they're HIPPIES!"
$LASTNAME at VERYWARMmail.com - Eric Cartman
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Date: 19 Sep 2007 23:42:03
From: ant
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
|
Joel wrote:
> ant <claimsagent_directives@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>> Awesome, thanks for that.
>>
>> And you can use pasteurised juice? I guess you add the yeast, and
>> all you need is sugar, that's in there.
>
> Yes, pasteurized is probably safest. What you to want to avoid
> is juice that has preservatives like potassium benzoate and
> similar additives. They act as a bacteria-- and yeast-- inhibitor.
yep, I avoid preservatives. nasty things, mostly.
--
ant
Don't try to reply to my email addy:
I'm borrowing that of the latest
scammer/spammer
|
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Date: 18 Sep 2007 23:09:53
From: Joel
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
|
Derric <derric1961@removethis.yahoo.com > wrote:
>> Do you end up with a higher alcohol content, like wine?
>
>In general, yes. I think that most "straight" apple juice will ferment
>to something in the 8-10% range. If you want a more wine-like 14% or so,
>you can add sugar/honey/etc.
In my admittedly limited experience, using standard
US apple cider you'll get something like a 4-5% abv
beverage.
That said, I chatted a bit with a commercial cider
and mead maker in Cornwall this past spring, and he
said the cider-specific varieties of apples they use
yield higher abv... my memory is hazy but I think he
was talking 8% or so.
--
Joel Plutchak "They're not people, they're HIPPIES!"
$LASTNAME at VERYWARMmail.com - Eric Cartman
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Date: 16 Sep 2007 09:59:03
From: Phil
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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On Sun, 16 Sep 2007 22:39:15 +1000, "ant"
<claimsagent_directives@yahoo.co.uk > wrote:
> Winemaking sounds scary and difficult (beer is
>straightforward), but I'm interested in it.
Winemaking is actually easier than beer if you use juice kits. If you
buy a non-cencentrated kit (ie: Mosti Mondiale) you'll get all the
ingredients to make six gallons of wine.
Real good wine.
Phil
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Date: 17 Sep 2007 00:23:34
From: ant
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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Phil wrote:
> On Sun, 16 Sep 2007 22:39:15 +1000, "ant"
> <claimsagent_directives@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> Winemaking sounds scary and difficult (beer is
>> straightforward), but I'm interested in it.
>
> Winemaking is actually easier than beer if you use juice kits. If you
> buy a non-cencentrated kit (ie: Mosti Mondiale) you'll get all the
> ingredients to make six gallons of wine.
>
> Real good wine.
I suspect they don't have those here in Oz. I've not seen them. I've had
some awsome home-made wines from friends in the US, but bugger-all here in
Oz, and there's nothing in my brewshop for plonk although the owner reckons
he has clients who make wine. he flogs them yeasts and stuff for what they
do. He gets upset when they are after sodium metabisulphate for sanitising
(and rightly too). awful stuff.
I had the most amazing home-made apricot plonk from a mate in utah, who was
from Pocitello in Idaho, who was a kicked-out mormon. This stuff was lovely,
with a fine almost champagne-like bead/effervescence. I'd have not known it
was from apricots if he'd not told me. Very professional stuff. He used to
drive tanks, so there you go.
--
ant
Don't try to reply to my email addy:
I'm borrowing that of the latest
scammer/spammer
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Date: 16 Sep 2007 15:14:11
From: Faux_Pseudo
Subject: sodium metabisulphate and pumpkin ale (was Re: Alcoholic fruit juice)
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_.-In rec.crafts.brewing, ant wrote the following -._
> I suspect they don't have those here in Oz. I've not seen them. I've had
> some awsome home-made wines from friends in the US, but bugger-all here in
> Oz, and there's nothing in my brewshop for plonk although the owner reckons
> he has clients who make wine. he flogs them yeasts and stuff for what they
> do. He gets upset when they are after sodium metabisulphate for sanitising
> (and rightly too). awful stuff.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_metabisulfite
At the local brew club meeting this came up the other day when 20 or
so people spent over an hour talking about the best ways to make
pumpkin ale. One person suggested that in oder to stop the yeast
before they eat up all the pumpkin flavor[0] was to kill them all off
with sodium metabisulphate.
What other sanitiser would you recomend if this was path that someone
wanted to go for retaining pumpkin flavor in there beer?
[0] try the blue moon pumpkin ale for an example of a pumpkinless
pumpkin ale
--
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Date: 16 Sep 2007 07:13:46
From: Adam Preble
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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"ant" <claimsagent_directives@yahoo.co.uk > wrote in
news:5l37v2F66uc9U1@mid.individual.net:
> Someone here posted a story about some cherry juice going alcoholic,
> and there was brief talk about fermenting fruit juice. I just wanted
> to clarify this, as it's an interesting idea.
>
> So, could you get a plastic bottle of, say, guava juice or something,
> put in some sort of yeast, and end up with alcoholised juice? I must
> be missing something, it must be harder than that?
>
They don't call that "wine" around here?
I had made 5 gallons of wine from guava nectar by getting the appropriate
volume of Del Valle guava nectar, and then adding enough sugar to bring its
original gravity to about 90 points. It finished dry and needed a little
extra sugar to dull the bite.
I did something similar with a gallon of Ocean Spray cranberry juice. I
think they add coloring to it because the resulting wine was more like a
blush, but it was very tasty.
As others have said, beware preservatives. Not all of them are bad, but
you shouldn't get a ton of something that has sorbates, for example; do a
test batch first with a small amount.
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Date: 15 Sep 2007 23:19:50
From: Washu
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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On Sep 15, 6:25 pm, "ant" <claimsagent_directi...@yahoo.co.uk > wrote:
> Someone here posted a story about some cherry juice going alcoholic, and
> there was brief talk about fermenting fruit juice. I just wanted to clarify
> this, as it's an interesting idea.
>
> So, could you get a plastic bottle of, say, guava juice or something, put in
> some sort of yeast, and end up with alcoholised juice? I must be missing
> something, it must be harder than that?
This is the basic procedure for wine/cider production. You take some
fruit juice, add yeast and wait.
I would use a glass gallon jug and an airlock myself, but whatever
makes you happy. You might
want to try some plastic wrap and a rubber band to cap the bottle with
though that way you'd
blow off the wrap before the bottle split open.
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Date: 16 Sep 2007 18:40:48
From: Randall Nortman
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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On 2007-09-16, Washu <rgrantha@yahoo.com > wrote:
[...]
> I would use a glass gallon jug and an airlock myself, but whatever
> makes you happy. You might
> want to try some plastic wrap and a rubber band to cap the bottle with
> though that way you'd
> blow off the wrap before the bottle split open.
You're saying that you just hold the plastic wrap on with the rubber
band, no cap? Doesn't sound like it would hold much pressure at all,
and therefore you wouldn't develop much carbonation. I guess if
you're going for a still wine that would be fine, but fizzy is nice.
--
Randall
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Date: 16 Sep 2007 22:32:21
From: ant
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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Washu wrote:
> On Sep 15, 6:25 pm, "ant" <claimsagent_directi...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>> Someone here posted a story about some cherry juice going alcoholic,
>> and there was brief talk about fermenting fruit juice. I just wanted
>> to clarify this, as it's an interesting idea.
>>
>> So, could you get a plastic bottle of, say, guava juice or
>> something, put in some sort of yeast, and end up with alcoholised
>> juice? I must be missing something, it must be harder than that?
>
> This is the basic procedure for wine/cider production. You take some
> fruit juice, add yeast and wait.
> I would use a glass gallon jug and an airlock myself, but whatever
> makes you happy. You might
> want to try some plastic wrap and a rubber band to cap the bottle with
> though that way you'd
> blow off the wrap before the bottle split open.
Nice idea. I have a giant glass container I used to use for aging port, it
has a push-on plastic lid. Perfect. It's huge.
Er, so, any special yeast to use? So far I've only made beer, and with lager
yeasts. I figure this fruit thing uses ale-y type warmer yeasts? Any
recommendations?
--
ant
Don't try to reply to my email addy:
I'm borrowing that of the latest
scammer/spammer
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Date: 15 Sep 2007 23:45:47
From: Faux_Pseudo
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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_.-In rec.crafts.brewing, ant wrote the following -._
> Someone here posted a story about some cherry juice going alcoholic, and
> there was brief talk about fermenting fruit juice. I just wanted to clarify
> this, as it's an interesting idea.
That was me.
> So, could you get a plastic bottle of, say, guava juice or something, put in
> some sort of yeast, and end up with alcoholised juice? I must be missing
> something, it must be harder than that?
The only part you really missed was about putting it in a plastic soda
bottle so the juice bottle won't explode. I am brewing tomarrow, some
of the yeast will go toward this project.
--
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Date: 16 Sep 2007 03:05:15
From: Andrew
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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Faux_Pseudo wrote:
>
> The only part you really missed was about putting it in a plastic soda
> bottle so the juice bottle won't explode.
>
The other day at the brew store the owner showed
me s new beer kit. Basically you buy a 2 litre
bottle of wort, add a yeast tab and put on a
special cap that is included. 2 weeks later you
have 2 litres of carbonated beer. Apparently it is
very good.
I asked about acquiring some of the special,
pressure regulating caps and was told that they
were not available separately. Too bad.
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Date: 16 Sep 2007 13:04:52
From: HbDragon
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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That sounds kind of neat for someone who is curious about starting the hobby
but is not certain how. Except for those pressure release caps, doesn't
sound like much for the experienced brewer.
But, yes, just might help someone who wants to start. However, that short
wait, 2 weeks, sounds nice for "in a pinch"...
If you're chronically "time challenged".
"Andrew" <justaskmeforit@shaw.ca > wrote in message
news:L31Hi.182583$fJ5.136615@pd7urf1no...
> Faux_Pseudo wrote:
> The other day at the brew store the owner showed me s new beer kit.
> Basically you buy a 2 litre bottle of wort, add a yeast tab and put on a
> special cap that is included. 2 weeks later you have 2 litres of
> carbonated beer. Apparently it is very good.
>
> I asked about acquiring some of the special, pressure regulating caps and
> was told that they were not available separately. Too bad.
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Date: 16 Sep 2007 22:29:35
From: ant
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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Andrew wrote:
> Faux_Pseudo wrote:
>
>>
>> The only part you really missed was about putting it in a plastic
>> soda bottle so the juice bottle won't explode.
>>
>
> The other day at the brew store the owner showed
> me s new beer kit. Basically you buy a 2 litre
> bottle of wort, add a yeast tab and put on a
> special cap that is included. 2 weeks later you
> have 2 litres of carbonated beer. Apparently it is
> very good.
>
> I asked about acquiring some of the special,
> pressure regulating caps and was told that they
> were not available separately. Too bad.
2 litres?! What's the use of that? It'd want to be very good indeed.
The cap must be a one way pressure valve, like those plastic bags you use to
get rid of the air and pack in more luggage.
--
ant
Don't try to reply to my email addy:
I'm borrowing that of the latest
scammer/spammer
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Date: 16 Sep 2007 03:27:06
From: Dick Adams
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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Andrew <justaskmeforit@shaw.ca >
> Faux_Pseudo wrote:
>> The only part you really missed was about putting it in
>> a plastic soda bottle so the juice bottle won't explode.
> The other day at the brew store the owner showed
> me s new beer kit. Basically you buy a 2 litre
> bottle of wort, add a yeast tab and put on a
> special cap that is included. 2 weeks later you
> have 2 litres of carbonated beer. Apparently it is
> very good.
>
> I asked about acquiring some of the special,
> pressure regulating caps and was told that they
> were not available separately. Too bad.
I have some and they are OZ-Tops. They may be great,
but you can buy bungs (with air-lock holes) that fit
into two liter bottles to accomplish the very same
thing. Bungs for gallon bottles also fit into 3 liter
boottles.
Dick
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Date: 16 Sep 2007 09:55:30
From: ant
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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Faux_Pseudo wrote:
> _.-In rec.crafts.brewing, ant wrote the following -._
>> Someone here posted a story about some cherry juice going alcoholic,
>> and there was brief talk about fermenting fruit juice. I just wanted
>> to clarify this, as it's an interesting idea.
>
> That was me.
>
>> So, could you get a plastic bottle of, say, guava juice or
>> something, put in some sort of yeast, and end up with alcoholised
>> juice? I must be missing something, it must be harder than that?
>
> The only part you really missed was about putting it in a plastic soda
> bottle so the juice bottle won't explode. I am brewing tomarrow, some
> of the yeast will go toward this project.
In a PET bottle, yep, got that. So, let me get this straight: you'd
sanitize everything as per beer, get some nice juice... would you warm it at
all? Or get a cooler yeast, like for lager?
Then put the yeast in the juice, and put it all in a PET bottle... (or put
juice in PET first, and add yeast to that?).
Any kind of juice to avoid eg orange? Too acidic?
--
ant
Don't try to reply to my email addy:
I'm borrowing that of the latest
scammer/spammer
|
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Date: 16 Sep 2007 00:39:35
From: Faux_Pseudo
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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_.-In rec.crafts.brewing, ant wrote the following -._
> So, let me get this straight: you'd
> sanitize everything as per beer, get some nice juice... would you warm it at
> all?
I am keeping at 70 right now which is what I am going to ferment at.
> Then put the yeast in the juice, and put it all in a PET bottle... (or put
> juice in PET first, and add yeast to that?).
I am going to put the juice in and aerate it. Pitch yeast and cap it.
> Any kind of juice to avoid eg orange? Too acidic?
I am no expert but I would avoid anything that you haven't seen
fermented to under 20% alcohol before. Orange juice, strawberries,
etc. Odds are things like that won't work too good.
--
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Date: 16 Sep 2007 13:04:11
From: Bob F
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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"Faux_Pseudo" <Faux.Pseudo@gmail.com > wrote in message
news:bX_Gi.313571$dA7.186783@newsfe16.lga...
> _.-In rec.crafts.brewing, ant wrote the following -._
>> So, let me get this straight: you'd
>> sanitize everything as per beer, get some nice juice... would you warm it at
>> all?
>
> I am keeping at 70 right now which is what I am going to ferment at.
>
>> Then put the yeast in the juice, and put it all in a PET bottle... (or put
>> juice in PET first, and add yeast to that?).
>
> I am going to put the juice in and aerate it. Pitch yeast and cap it.
>
>> Any kind of juice to avoid eg orange? Too acidic?
>
> I am no expert but I would avoid anything that you haven't seen
> fermented to under 20% alcohol before. Orange juice, strawberries,
> etc. Odds are things like that won't work too good.
Remember to watch it for overpressure. The juice you had before was probably
only slightly fermented. Fermenting the juice to completion will likely result
in over-pressurization, with multiple possibilities of problems. Lightly
fermented apple cider is a delicious sweet drink in my experience. Any other
juice would likely be similar. I would taste it periodically during fermentation
just to learn where it can go along the way. Just disturb the bottle enough
after tasting to make it foam enough to push out any air, if you are worried
about oxygenation, although I've had no such problems with cider.
Bob
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Date: 15 Sep 2007 19:18:25
From: DragonTail
Subject: Re: Alcoholic fruit juice
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ant wrote:
> Faux_Pseudo wrote:
>> _.-In rec.crafts.brewing, ant wrote the following -._
>>> Someone here posted a story about some cherry juice going alcoholic,
>>> and there was brief talk about fermenting fruit juice. I just wanted
>>> to clarify this, as it's an interesting idea.
>> That was me.
>>
>>> So, could you get a plastic bottle of, say, guava juice or
>>> something, put in some sort of yeast, and end up with alcoholised
>>> juice? I must be missing something, it must be harder than that?
>> The only part you really missed was about putting it in a plastic soda
>> bottle so the juice bottle won't explode. I am brewing tomarrow, some
>> of the yeast will go toward this project.
>
> In a PET bottle, yep, got that. So, let me get this straight: you'd
> sanitize everything as per beer, get some nice juice... would you warm it at
> all? Or get a cooler yeast, like for lager?
> Then put the yeast in the juice, and put it all in a PET bottle... (or put
> juice in PET first, and add yeast to that?).
> Any kind of juice to avoid eg orange? Too acidic?
>
The main thing is to make sure the juice doesn't contain any
preservatives. If it does, I'm not sure how to cure this as I've only
fermented cider straight from the orchard, someone else may be able to
help with that.
I have left "fresh" cider in the fridge for a few months and ended up
with something a little more "tangy" with pressure in the bottle.
If you find something to use, ferment at ale temps, at least that is
what I have done.
As for orange juice, I've only used fresh squeezed for mead starters.
Cheers,
--
Michael Herrenbruck
Herrenbruck Brewery
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